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the planets awesome masters almost

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surely have a plan

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this clearly maybe something there

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beyond the realm of man and it's already

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tested every particle just you I'm fine

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the more you think you know the less you

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really do that's true dr. Zaius where

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thank you

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though no one

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where would we be

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without the

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[Applause]

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all right higher side chatters we know

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that people have been gathering in

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secret groups for about as long as

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there's been people for one reason or

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another some want to preserve sacred and

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powerful magical traditions from the

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destructive campaigns to eradicate them

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some want to influence and infiltrate

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the dominant power structures of their

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time and some want to covertly organize

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world events and slave humanity and be

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the last hidden hand that reigned

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supreme on this island earth but unless

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you intend to spend years climbing the

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ranks of the countless societies sects

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and orders out there to really know

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their traditions true influence and

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agenda can seem damn near impossible but

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fear not ladies and gentlemen because

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the legendary author and now seven-time

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THC guest Nick Redfern has turned his

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attention to covert organizations in his

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newest book secret societies the

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complete guide to history's rites and

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rituals it's 400 pages cataloging and

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describing well over a hundred groups of

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the past and present who would rather be

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left unknown we've talked to Nick about

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fatal UFO encounters the world's

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weirdest places Disney and the deep

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state cryptids missing government files

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and today we're diving deep into his

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hefty new encyclopedia of alliances

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agendas and under the radar groups I

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couldn't be more psyched Nick my man

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welcome back to the higher side hey

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except me on again yeah of course

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pleasure is always mine we've been doing

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this on occasion since my 25th episode

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way back in 2012 so I really have to

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thank you because you've obviously been

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a big part of the journey and you've

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written a ton of great books along the

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way and now this guy to secret societies

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which seems like quite an undertaking

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really there are so many that have died

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out or have been squashed or absorbed

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they change their names stay out of the

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limelight so it can be a challenging

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study but before we get into specifics

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what can you say about this project

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overall has it changed or influenced

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your outlook on secret groups did you

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come away thinking differently about the

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overreaching subject matter in any

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significant way well I think more than

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anything else just a very existence of

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secret societies suggests that in terms

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of history and sort of the ongoing world

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today

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you know we don't really see the full

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picture because there are powerful

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figures pulling the strings behind the

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scenes

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now other secret societies are sort of

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more obscure you know what they don't

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have widespread power so to speak other

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ones do and you know there's a wealth of

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bizarre historical ones as well and also

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obscure ones too so in other words what

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I tried to do with the book was the

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format of the book which was published

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by visible ink press I've done several

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books with them and the layout is always

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the same they like a to Z style 200

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entries per book and so that was sort of

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the challenge was to come up with 200

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secret societies to talk about now of

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course if you're going to talk about

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secret societies or semi secret ones I

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mean you have to include the obvious

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ones like the Illuminati and the Masons

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that everybody's heard of but what I try

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to do with the book was to also sort of

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dig out a lot of obscure groups but also

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was they were very intriguing and you

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know fascinating stories surrounding

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them and to sort of demonstrate to

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people the different meanings for what a

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secret society might actually be it's

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sort of a political group as you engage

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in occult rituals and rites or is it

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something you know there's more of an

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economic based organization that has an

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influence on the world stage so to speak

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so it pretty much covers just read

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everything that I guess conceivably

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could fall into the category of a secret

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society mm-hmm well if you just laid out

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your mission for the book I would say

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mission accomplished because it's really

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good oh no from cast such a wide net and

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cover so many groups let me ask you how

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often do you find that a secret group at

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its core has some type of magical

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tradition whether it's rituals to travel

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to the astral plane or alchemy or

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contacting entities or something along

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those lines it seems to be one of the

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biggest catalysts for forming a secret

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group with maybe racism coming in second

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now that's actually a good point because

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in many ancient groups you know you have

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these stories and and links to the

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occult and supernatural activity I mean

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even if you look at like the Freemasons

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you know you have one

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none of the so called the greater

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architect and also if you go back into

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Egyptian times where they had their own

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secret societies many of those were sort

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of based around like Egyptian magicians

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and things like that and you can find

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that throughout so many of these

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organizations where you know they call

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upon ancient gods you have secret

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societies that are not just a cult based

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but have a connection with sort of devil

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worship and things like that

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and I think the main areas that secret

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societies seem to gravitate to power

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influence money and the ability to

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control and lead so to speak and

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manipulate and I think that probably

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says as much about not just a group but

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the people who are drawn to them people

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who have made sort of lust for power and

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influence even if it's behind the scenes

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in a secret way rather than like an

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overt open way no doubt and like I had

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mentioned we've talked for many hours

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about many things at this point and one

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slice of the weird pie you've written

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about and talked about extensively

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elsewhere is the Collins elite and they

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make an appearance in this book too but

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until recently when I would hear that a

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group within the government is looking

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at the et UFO phenomenon from the

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perspective of demons I used to think

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that was simplistic reasoning from

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people who just wanted to fit this

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strangeness into their religious

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paradigm but maybe this is a perspective

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that we shouldn't dismiss right away

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what can be said about the Collins elite

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in the way they're looking at the et

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issue

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well the Collins elite is a book that I

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first wrote about seven years ago in

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2010 in the book called final events and

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it was a story there I was put onto by a

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guy named Rob O'Shea ray lives in

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Lincoln Nebraska and his backgrounds

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interesting he's a priest but he was in

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the 80s he run the MUFON chapter in

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Nebraska communal UFO network and he was

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approached in the early 90s by a number

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of people working on this program in the

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Department of Defense which was

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essentially trying to resolve the UFO

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issue and even contact these you know

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alien entities predominately by

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something like Rim

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viewing like mind-to-mind contact and

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the more that the group got involved in

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it the more they came to believe they

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were dealing with something that wasn't

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extraterrestrial but something that was

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quite literally demonic that's how they

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came to perceive it now by their own

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admission this was their belief system

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you know it wasn't something that was

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born out of hard provable fact it was

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their suspicions and their connections

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and linkages and putting all these

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different things together but what began

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as two think-tank within the government

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became more of like a secret society

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where they had not just intelligence

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based people on the program after a

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while they were inviting into the fold

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priests demonologists people who were

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sort of well versed and learned in

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ancient manuscripts on demonology and

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things like this and they had all sorts

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of people on board and it really did

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become sort of a study of the occult to

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try and understand the nature of the UFO

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phenomena but also having experts in the

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field of like the history of people like

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Aleister Crowley and Jack Parsons who

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was one of crow is more famous disciple

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so to speak and so in other words you

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know you had this group which was fluid

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and with flexible in terms of its

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membership and how it operated but you

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know imagine going into this room where

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you have a demonologist sat next to an

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intelligence agent next to him is an

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expert in translating 700 year old

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Middle Eastern texts on demons and then

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somebody else who was an expert on Ouija

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boards and how to summon up supernatural

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entities sometimes which required the

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need for certain rituals to be

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undertaken that you can see how it was

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transformed from something like the

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equivalent of Project Blue Book you know

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a UFO program to where it became a

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definitive secret society really yeah I

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just think that is such an interesting

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perspective really and I guess another

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organization that comes up in this book

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is sta C which is another group kind of

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associated with

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in this vein right yeah and one of the

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interesting things is that I was never

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really sure what what it stood for SP

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ACI speculated in doing research maybe

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was something like science and

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technology and something else you know

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and because of what they're involved in

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it could have been something like

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science technology and Christianity but

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I don't know I'm speculating or guess in

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there but yeah that's one of the

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interesting things is that there were at

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least a couple of groups certainly the

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college elite still exist but that you

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know whether it's under that name or

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nickname I don't know today but the stat

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group was similar in the sense of they

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were also pursuing this sort of demonic

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angle and the may well have been a third

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group as well and we know for sure that

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there was a group in the late 60s

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created by the CIA called Operation

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often and this particular group also was

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heavily involved in trying to weaponize

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the occult you know and I think when you

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start going down that path of doing line

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Faustian pact you know it amazing you

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can never end up well but nevertheless

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you had all these different groups and

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they were all China understand the

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nature of supernatural phenomena

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Crossing girl with demonic activity and

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recklessly thinking can we harness this

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and weaponize it almost like can we

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control demons you know and have them do

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bidding that sort of thing which you

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know whether people believe in demons or

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they think they're supernatural entities

277
00:11:04,160 --> 00:11:01,590
that can be explained by science you

278
00:11:06,350 --> 00:11:04,170
know the different theories but I don't

279
00:11:08,600 --> 00:11:06,360
think either way it's a good thing to

280
00:11:11,180 --> 00:11:08,610
sort of go down that path but the skat

281
00:11:14,240 --> 00:11:11,190
group they were one of the groups that

282
00:11:16,700 --> 00:11:14,250
was China open doors and portals to

283
00:11:19,250 --> 00:11:16,710
whatever realms of existence these

284
00:11:22,400 --> 00:11:19,260
things came from and they was more of a

285
00:11:24,680 --> 00:11:22,410
looking at the science aspect of it

286
00:11:27,190 --> 00:11:24,690
whereas the Collins elite were very much

287
00:11:29,450 --> 00:11:27,200
steeped in you know Old Testament

288
00:11:32,270 --> 00:11:29,460
religious belief systems so they were

289
00:11:33,980 --> 00:11:32,280
covering similar territory but they're

290
00:11:36,320 --> 00:11:33,990
approaching it from a kind of a

291
00:11:39,710 --> 00:11:36,330
different angle really hmm

292
00:11:41,270 --> 00:11:39,720
wow man so any whispers or updates about

293
00:11:43,070 --> 00:11:41,280
the Collins elite if they are still

294
00:11:45,590 --> 00:11:43,080
around since you wrote that book seven

295
00:11:46,550 --> 00:11:45,600
years ago yeah well what happened was

296
00:11:48,530 --> 00:11:46,560
that I mean one of

297
00:11:50,960 --> 00:11:48,540
things I pointed out early on in the

298
00:11:53,180 --> 00:11:50,970
book is that the people I spoke to from

299
00:11:56,480 --> 00:11:53,190
the group and I only spoke to about nine

300
00:11:58,340 --> 00:11:56,490
ten eleven twelve of the members some of

301
00:12:01,490 --> 00:11:58,350
them were retired and I truthfully don't

302
00:12:03,710 --> 00:12:01,500
know how many people in any given time

303
00:12:06,800 --> 00:12:03,720
were in the group but from some of the

304
00:12:08,960 --> 00:12:06,810
things that people said any time it

305
00:12:10,910 --> 00:12:08,970
probably was up to about thirty or forty

306
00:12:13,820 --> 00:12:10,920
you know it wasn't an agency like the

307
00:12:15,829 --> 00:12:13,830
size of the CIA the NSA or the FBI but

308
00:12:18,230 --> 00:12:15,839
it was this obscure cult side group

309
00:12:20,300 --> 00:12:18,240
society that was being funded you know

310
00:12:22,850 --> 00:12:20,310
in a covert fashion now they told me

311
00:12:24,530 --> 00:12:22,860
that the Collins elite was essentially

312
00:12:26,540 --> 00:12:24,540
like a nickname that was given to the

313
00:12:28,850 --> 00:12:26,550
group he was like an in-house joke which

314
00:12:31,550 --> 00:12:28,860
was a long complicated story won't go

315
00:12:33,860 --> 00:12:31,560
into but the Collins elite was basically

316
00:12:37,880 --> 00:12:33,870
a nickname now there may well have been

317
00:12:40,070 --> 00:12:37,890
an official classified name but if there

318
00:12:41,780 --> 00:12:40,080
was I didn't get that and I do think

319
00:12:44,120 --> 00:12:41,790
that possibly the term the Collins elite

320
00:12:45,829 --> 00:12:44,130
was from their perspective it was like a

321
00:12:47,269 --> 00:12:45,839
comfortable way of being able to talk

322
00:12:49,820 --> 00:12:47,279
about the group without possibly

323
00:12:51,770 --> 00:12:49,830
compromising the real classified title

324
00:12:54,590 --> 00:12:51,780
now to get to your points of the

325
00:12:56,420 --> 00:12:54,600
question I do still get snippets of

326
00:12:58,940 --> 00:12:56,430
information here and there from people

327
00:13:01,250 --> 00:12:58,950
who would clearly approached by the

328
00:13:03,829 --> 00:13:01,260
Collins elite were secretly consulted

329
00:13:06,860 --> 00:13:03,839
people like demonologists theologians

330
00:13:08,570 --> 00:13:06,870
you know people who had looked into the

331
00:13:11,240 --> 00:13:08,580
issue of witchcraft and things like that

332
00:13:13,340 --> 00:13:11,250
and I've got several people who since

333
00:13:16,160 --> 00:13:13,350
the book came out said words to the

334
00:13:18,650 --> 00:13:16,170
effect of you know is approached back in

335
00:13:20,570 --> 00:13:18,660
1981 aware by this strange group of

336
00:13:24,470 --> 00:13:20,580
people from government and they wanted

337
00:13:27,260 --> 00:13:24,480
me to decipher and translate and relate

338
00:13:30,079 --> 00:13:27,270
to them this 14th century manuscript

339
00:13:32,300 --> 00:13:30,089
they got their hands on and it's almost

340
00:13:34,100 --> 00:13:32,310
serving the case again I can't prove but

341
00:13:36,860 --> 00:13:34,110
it's almost certainly the case that they

342
00:13:40,100 --> 00:13:36,870
were talking about the Collins elite so

343
00:13:42,590 --> 00:13:40,110
I have a lot of snippets like that when

344
00:13:44,840 --> 00:13:42,600
I don't have you know is thing the

345
00:13:47,840 --> 00:13:44,850
definitive smoking gun but when I hear

346
00:13:49,760 --> 00:13:47,850
these stories time and again snippets

347
00:13:51,470 --> 00:13:49,770
here and there from different people not

348
00:13:54,019 --> 00:13:51,480
just across the country but actually

349
00:13:56,750 --> 00:13:54,029
across the world as well it does sound

350
00:13:58,550 --> 00:13:56,760
like the Collins elite or at least the

351
00:14:00,260 --> 00:13:58,560
stat group or one of these others but

352
00:14:02,620 --> 00:14:00,270
maybe they're all part

353
00:14:04,550 --> 00:14:02,630
parcel of a bigger kind of umbrella

354
00:14:06,400 --> 00:14:04,560
organization you know that's some kind

355
00:14:09,740 --> 00:14:06,410
of occasionally thought of as well

356
00:14:12,260 --> 00:14:09,750
mm-hmm that is awesome and I mean the

357
00:14:14,270 --> 00:14:12,270
the Collins elite perspective it also

358
00:14:15,980 --> 00:14:14,280
brought back the Montauk Project to the

359
00:14:18,440 --> 00:14:15,990
forefront of my mind because that seems

360
00:14:21,890 --> 00:14:18,450
more in line with the type of magical

361
00:14:24,110 --> 00:14:21,900
ritual in certain respects right well

362
00:14:26,510 --> 00:14:24,120
yeah I mean one of the things that

363
00:14:29,120 --> 00:14:26,520
stands out from everything that Collins

364
00:14:31,760 --> 00:14:29,130
really did was that it required some

365
00:14:34,310 --> 00:14:31,770
sort of like you said like a ritualistic

366
00:14:36,920 --> 00:14:34,320
aspect of this where you know when I

367
00:14:38,660 --> 00:14:36,930
said they were trying to contact well if

368
00:14:40,460 --> 00:14:38,670
they first thought raelians and then

369
00:14:43,040 --> 00:14:40,470
they came to believe we're demonic

370
00:14:44,450 --> 00:14:43,050
entities we're not talking about trying

371
00:14:46,940 --> 00:14:44,460
to contact them and have them come and

372
00:14:48,800 --> 00:14:46,950
land out at area 51 or outside the White

373
00:14:51,260 --> 00:14:48,810
House mean what it was he was like a

374
00:14:54,050 --> 00:14:51,270
mind to mind thing and some of the guys

375
00:14:56,510 --> 00:14:54,060
said that the people who could do this

376
00:14:58,750 --> 00:14:56,520
really well kind of similar to the

377
00:15:01,310 --> 00:14:58,760
remote viewers of the 1970s and the 80s

378
00:15:05,180 --> 00:15:01,320
they had contacted on a mind-to-mind

379
00:15:07,550 --> 00:15:05,190
basis these entities and initially they

380
00:15:09,380 --> 00:15:07,560
thought they were as I said aliens and

381
00:15:11,570 --> 00:15:09,390
then the more they got into it tinkling

382
00:15:14,660 --> 00:15:11,580
the project started to fall sick some of

383
00:15:16,520 --> 00:15:14,670
them died there was sort of weird runs

384
00:15:18,560 --> 00:15:16,530
of bad luck and like some sort of

385
00:15:22,550 --> 00:15:18,570
negative backlash like a dark cloud

386
00:15:25,250 --> 00:15:22,560
descended on the program and when it

387
00:15:28,070 --> 00:15:25,260
worked when these contacts work and even

388
00:15:30,140 --> 00:15:28,080
though went down a negative path the

389
00:15:32,090 --> 00:15:30,150
reason was because to get back against

390
00:15:34,070 --> 00:15:32,100
you points is that they were performing

391
00:15:36,710 --> 00:15:34,080
rituals or getting themselves into

392
00:15:39,140 --> 00:15:36,720
altered states of mind and trying to

393
00:15:41,780 --> 00:15:39,150
summon these things that invoke them so

394
00:15:44,000 --> 00:15:41,790
there was a ritualistic altered state

395
00:15:47,000 --> 00:15:44,010
type situation that you find in many

396
00:15:50,000 --> 00:15:47,010
secret societies if you look at South

397
00:15:52,460 --> 00:15:50,010
America Africa Central America where you

398
00:15:55,310 --> 00:15:52,470
have again these ritualistic activities

399
00:15:57,380 --> 00:15:55,320
where you have a local shame and in the

400
00:15:59,360 --> 00:15:57,390
village you know get into an altered

401
00:16:01,640 --> 00:15:59,370
state of mind and commune with higher

402
00:16:04,250 --> 00:16:01,650
entities that's basically what they were

403
00:16:06,650 --> 00:16:04,260
doing with the Collins elite in the

404
00:16:08,180 --> 00:16:06,660
intelligence agencies they had people

405
00:16:11,180 --> 00:16:08,190
who could get into altered states of

406
00:16:13,580 --> 00:16:11,190
mind whether through hallucinogenics or

407
00:16:16,520 --> 00:16:13,590
chemical stimulation

408
00:16:18,590 --> 00:16:16,530
they would Cheyenne use ancient rituals

409
00:16:20,420 --> 00:16:18,600
to invoke these things through now

410
00:16:22,210 --> 00:16:20,430
apparently they did but not in sort of

411
00:16:24,590 --> 00:16:22,220
physical form but like an ethereal

412
00:16:26,900 --> 00:16:24,600
almost like an invisible presence like a

413
00:16:29,770 --> 00:16:26,910
poltergeist you know in the in the home

414
00:16:32,360 --> 00:16:29,780
that sort of thing where it was clear

415
00:16:34,250 --> 00:16:32,370
things were going wrong and that there

416
00:16:36,380 --> 00:16:34,260
was this dark cloud and you know it's

417
00:16:38,690 --> 00:16:36,390
like it was this atmosphere that you

418
00:16:40,520 --> 00:16:38,700
could almost cut with a knife people

419
00:16:42,740 --> 00:16:40,530
sometimes get busy forging houses they

420
00:16:46,010 --> 00:16:42,750
go into the house and they just get this

421
00:16:47,840 --> 00:16:46,020
weird vibe and that's what happened with

422
00:16:49,640 --> 00:16:47,850
the columns he laid it was as if their

423
00:16:51,740 --> 00:16:49,650
territory where they were working was

424
00:16:54,020 --> 00:16:51,750
somehow almost like supernaturally

425
00:16:56,240 --> 00:16:54,030
infected by these things and as I said

426
00:17:00,410 --> 00:16:56,250
he went down a very dark path from there

427
00:17:02,360 --> 00:17:00,420
on hmm yeah and then uh like the Montauk

428
00:17:04,810 --> 00:17:02,370
Project has some similar elements in

429
00:17:07,190 --> 00:17:04,820
that it seemed to be heavily based on

430
00:17:09,350 --> 00:17:07,200
consciousness studies to a degree or

431
00:17:11,930 --> 00:17:09,360
consciousness experiments and people

432
00:17:13,670 --> 00:17:11,940
talk about things coming through portals

433
00:17:16,370 --> 00:17:13,680
and I used to think about that in a very

434
00:17:18,500 --> 00:17:16,380
physical way but now I looked at some

435
00:17:21,530 --> 00:17:18,510
more Montauk Project literature and they

436
00:17:23,240 --> 00:17:21,540
talk about creating Bigfoot like Tulpas

437
00:17:26,390 --> 00:17:23,250
which you know is like a spiritual

438
00:17:28,340 --> 00:17:26,400
entity so I'm thinking wow like and you

439
00:17:31,300 --> 00:17:28,350
mentioned Jack Parsons and Aleister

440
00:17:34,300 --> 00:17:31,310
Crowley earlier the connections between

441
00:17:37,640 --> 00:17:34,310
ritual magic of an ancient type and

442
00:17:39,470 --> 00:17:37,650
modern science it seems these people

443
00:17:41,870 --> 00:17:39,480
seem to be fairly linked or at least

444
00:17:45,110 --> 00:17:41,880
have interlocking interests that aren't

445
00:17:46,760 --> 00:17:45,120
quite apparent on the surface yeah

446
00:17:49,550 --> 00:17:46,770
that's right I mean if you look at for

447
00:17:52,250 --> 00:17:49,560
example both Crowley and Parsons I mean

448
00:17:53,720 --> 00:17:52,260
to a degree they both had we can make a

449
00:17:56,960 --> 00:17:53,730
good argument that they're both linked

450
00:17:59,690 --> 00:17:56,970
to UFOs I mean Crowley for example you

451
00:18:01,570 --> 00:17:59,700
know is sort of notorious for performing

452
00:18:03,980 --> 00:18:01,580
rites and rituals some of the very

453
00:18:06,740 --> 00:18:03,990
potentially dangerous Nate you know

454
00:18:09,260 --> 00:18:06,750
calling forth supernatural entities

455
00:18:12,440 --> 00:18:09,270
should I invoke them again for power

456
00:18:13,790 --> 00:18:12,450
money sex influence the whole the usual

457
00:18:16,670 --> 00:18:13,800
things that you get with secret

458
00:18:19,670 --> 00:18:16,680
societies and one of the perfect

459
00:18:23,810 --> 00:18:19,680
examples is just before the dawning of

460
00:18:26,480 --> 00:18:23,820
the 1920s Crowley invoked this entity

461
00:18:27,450 --> 00:18:26,490
that was known as lamb Li M now this

462
00:18:29,760 --> 00:18:27,460
again was when he

463
00:18:31,649 --> 00:18:29,770
in this altered state of mind and

464
00:18:34,440 --> 00:18:31,659
performing this ritual and if you look

465
00:18:37,950 --> 00:18:34,450
at Crowley's own drawing his piece of

466
00:18:41,310 --> 00:18:37,960
artwork of lamb I mean Crowley's picture

467
00:18:43,110 --> 00:18:41,320
looks eerily like the figure on the

468
00:18:45,029 --> 00:18:43,120
Front's and Whitley streamers communion

469
00:18:47,340 --> 00:18:45,039
the only difference is you don't have

470
00:18:49,560 --> 00:18:47,350
the heavy thick black eyes but

471
00:18:52,080 --> 00:18:49,570
everything else like a huge hairless

472
00:18:54,659 --> 00:18:52,090
head on top of a small body and these

473
00:18:57,000 --> 00:18:54,669
penetrating eyes and pointed chin he

474
00:19:00,799 --> 00:18:57,010
looks like a modern-day gray for the

475
00:19:03,720 --> 00:19:00,809
most part now on top of that one of

476
00:19:06,750 --> 00:19:03,730
Crowley's big disciples was I said Jack

477
00:19:10,080 --> 00:19:06,760
Parsons Jack Parsons in the 30s was one

478
00:19:12,180 --> 00:19:10,090
of the United States pioneering rocket

479
00:19:14,010 --> 00:19:12,190
pioneers to the extent there's actually

480
00:19:16,200 --> 00:19:14,020
a crater named after him on the surface

481
00:19:18,480 --> 00:19:16,210
of the Moon and it was the leading

482
00:19:21,600 --> 00:19:18,490
player in the creation of the Jet

483
00:19:24,029 --> 00:19:21,610
Propulsion lab in Pasadena and even to

484
00:19:25,440 --> 00:19:24,039
this day the JPL every Halloween they

485
00:19:27,630 --> 00:19:25,450
hold this sort of like a ritualistic

486
00:19:29,310 --> 00:19:27,640
little party to celebrate

487
00:19:31,649 --> 00:19:29,320
Crowley's life and they bring these

488
00:19:33,299 --> 00:19:31,659
mannequins out dressed as Parsons and

489
00:19:36,269 --> 00:19:33,309
his cohorts you know we like white lab

490
00:19:37,950 --> 00:19:36,279
rats that kind of thing but Parsons had

491
00:19:40,320 --> 00:19:37,960
a really sort of interesting background

492
00:19:42,810 --> 00:19:40,330
because as well as being a rocket expert

493
00:19:45,779 --> 00:19:42,820
as I said he was heavily into vehicles

494
00:19:48,779 --> 00:19:45,789
and a major follower of Crowley and

495
00:19:51,690 --> 00:19:48,789
before rocket launches you know he would

496
00:19:54,090 --> 00:19:51,700
invoke the ancient god pan as a means to

497
00:19:56,490 --> 00:19:54,100
ensure a safe flight so you know you had

498
00:19:59,279 --> 00:19:56,500
all these military Colonels and

499
00:20:01,860 --> 00:19:59,289
lieutenants and Generals you know hoping

500
00:20:03,690 --> 00:20:01,870
all these rocket tests were going to go

501
00:20:06,000 --> 00:20:03,700
well and then you've got the guy who's

502
00:20:07,620 --> 00:20:06,010
at the forefront of the program you know

503
00:20:09,690 --> 00:20:07,630
and he's conjuring up supernatural

504
00:20:11,279 --> 00:20:09,700
entities for a safe flight you have to

505
00:20:13,590 --> 00:20:11,289
wonder what the military thought about

506
00:20:15,330 --> 00:20:13,600
this but they knew he was a brilliant

507
00:20:18,360 --> 00:20:15,340
rocket scientist so they sort of turn

508
00:20:20,820 --> 00:20:18,370
their heads it is his other life but you

509
00:20:23,460 --> 00:20:20,830
know he got involved with l ron Hubbard

510
00:20:26,220 --> 00:20:23,470
long before Scientology and even

511
00:20:28,049 --> 00:20:26,230
Dianetics this was when when Hubbard was

512
00:20:30,510 --> 00:20:28,059
still a sci-fi writer and the two of

513
00:20:33,450 --> 00:20:30,520
them engage in a number of ritualistic

514
00:20:37,200 --> 00:20:33,460
activities and before his death in 52

515
00:20:41,320 --> 00:20:37,210
Parsons was convinced that at least part

516
00:20:43,750 --> 00:20:41,330
of the 1947 UFO way when he kicks off

517
00:20:45,640 --> 00:20:43,760
he believed that he had somehow opened a

518
00:20:47,590 --> 00:20:45,650
door that allowed the phenomenon to come

519
00:20:49,720 --> 00:20:47,600
through in other words he wasn't as

520
00:20:50,950 --> 00:20:49,730
simple as aliens coming from another

521
00:20:55,170 --> 00:20:50,960
world and flying through our atmosphere

522
00:20:57,790 --> 00:20:55,180
it was some evident he invoked them and

523
00:20:58,990 --> 00:20:57,800
allowed them to come through all made it

524
00:21:01,900 --> 00:20:59,000
easier for them

525
00:21:03,340 --> 00:21:01,910
Wow I don't think I've known a lot of

526
00:21:06,100 --> 00:21:03,350
that stuff and I don't think I ever have

527
00:21:09,070 --> 00:21:06,110
heard that Parsons himself thought he

528
00:21:11,440 --> 00:21:09,080
might be partially responsible for that

529
00:21:14,110 --> 00:21:11,450
kind of thing well yeah I mean he was

530
00:21:15,550 --> 00:21:14,120
heavily into the whole flying saucer

531
00:21:19,330 --> 00:21:15,560
business I mean I'll explain how it

532
00:21:20,710 --> 00:21:19,340
happened in the summer of 47 you had the

533
00:21:22,330 --> 00:21:20,720
Kenneth Arnold sighting that's what

534
00:21:25,000 --> 00:21:22,340
kicked everything off and led to the

535
00:21:27,670 --> 00:21:25,010
coining the term flying saucer now

536
00:21:29,980 --> 00:21:27,680
because Arnold's story was so

537
00:21:32,920 --> 00:21:29,990
fascinating inevitably a book was going

538
00:21:34,690 --> 00:21:32,930
to come out on it and Arnold's book the

539
00:21:36,250 --> 00:21:34,700
coming of the sources came out just a

540
00:21:39,250 --> 00:21:36,260
few years later he's actually written by

541
00:21:42,490 --> 00:21:39,260
Ray Palmer Ray Palmer was the editor of

542
00:21:45,940 --> 00:21:42,500
a number of massively selling sci-fi

543
00:21:48,340 --> 00:21:45,950
magazines in the 1940s and onwards so in

544
00:21:50,860 --> 00:21:48,350
other words you have Kenneth Arnold the

545
00:21:53,890 --> 00:21:50,870
go kicked off the UFO phenomenon linked

546
00:21:56,350 --> 00:21:53,900
to Ray Palmer now Ray Palmer as I said

547
00:21:59,950 --> 00:21:56,360
with a major sci-fi guy in the magazine

548
00:22:02,050 --> 00:21:59,960
world and Ray Palmer knew l ron Hubbard

549
00:22:03,880 --> 00:22:02,060
because at the time Hubbard was a sci-fi

550
00:22:08,080 --> 00:22:03,890
writer and the two would cross paths

551
00:22:10,630 --> 00:22:08,090
many times and then from there you have

552
00:22:13,300 --> 00:22:10,640
a connection also between Hubbard and

553
00:22:14,950 --> 00:22:13,310
Parsons and there are rumors and they

554
00:22:18,010 --> 00:22:14,960
are rumor but they wouldn't surprise

555
00:22:20,560 --> 00:22:18,020
they're not true but at some point all

556
00:22:22,990 --> 00:22:20,570
these people met together so you even

557
00:22:25,620 --> 00:22:23,000
had Arnold you're Palmer you had Hubbard

558
00:22:28,330 --> 00:22:25,630
and you're Parsons in the same room

559
00:22:30,160 --> 00:22:28,340
chatting about all of this now as I said

560
00:22:31,660 --> 00:22:30,170
that's still at the rumor mill level but

561
00:22:34,810 --> 00:22:31,670
it wouldn't surprise you because of the

562
00:22:37,510 --> 00:22:34,820
deep links that the four had together so

563
00:22:39,670 --> 00:22:37,520
again you can understand why a case can

564
00:22:42,330 --> 00:22:39,680
be made that there was a direct

565
00:22:45,490 --> 00:22:42,340
connection between Parsons Arnold

566
00:22:49,090 --> 00:22:45,500
Hubbard and all the rest of them in the

567
00:22:51,520 --> 00:22:49,100
sci-fi world who also gravitated to via

568
00:22:54,000 --> 00:22:51,530
cults as well oh yeah those were

569
00:22:57,030 --> 00:22:54,010
interesting times for sure and

570
00:22:59,039 --> 00:22:57,040
kind of along this line of thinking with

571
00:23:01,020 --> 00:22:59,049
its aliens and demons you read about the

572
00:23:01,890 --> 00:23:01,030
Loch Ness dragon cult which I'd never

573
00:23:03,330 --> 00:23:01,900
heard of before

574
00:23:05,549 --> 00:23:03,340
but if we're going to look at the

575
00:23:07,530 --> 00:23:05,559
possibility of aliens being related to

576
00:23:10,289 --> 00:23:07,540
magickal workings could this be true for

577
00:23:11,850 --> 00:23:10,299
the Loch Ness monster as well well I

578
00:23:14,430 --> 00:23:11,860
actually wrote a book last year called

579
00:23:16,500 --> 00:23:14,440
NASA which was about all the paranormal

580
00:23:18,210 --> 00:23:16,510
aspects of the Loch Ness monster mystery

581
00:23:20,039 --> 00:23:18,220
and there's really no doubt in my mind

582
00:23:22,440 --> 00:23:20,049
that there's a very sort of like an

583
00:23:24,539 --> 00:23:22,450
overwhelming paranormal aspect so a lot

584
00:23:27,180 --> 00:23:24,549
of like monster stories you know it's

585
00:23:30,000 --> 00:23:27,190
not just a colony of classier sores and

586
00:23:32,159 --> 00:23:30,010
that's the end of the story now one of

587
00:23:35,490 --> 00:23:32,169
the interesting things about Loch Ness

588
00:23:38,039 --> 00:23:35,500
is its history of phenomena that goes

589
00:23:40,470 --> 00:23:38,049
far beyond just the Nessie's so to speak

590
00:23:42,480 --> 00:23:40,480
I mean our old friend Aleister Crowley

591
00:23:43,890 --> 00:23:42,490
actually owned a house pretty much on

592
00:23:46,080 --> 00:23:43,900
the shore of Loch Ness called burlesque

593
00:23:49,710 --> 00:23:46,090
in-house which burned down at the end of

594
00:23:52,710 --> 00:23:49,720
2015 and I mean the story itself of

595
00:23:55,230 --> 00:23:52,720
Crowley's is meno intriguing enough the

596
00:23:57,150 --> 00:23:55,240
fact that he had this house there again

597
00:23:59,580 --> 00:23:57,160
performing all sorts of rituals this is

598
00:24:02,159 --> 00:23:59,590
in the early part of the 20th century

599
00:24:04,110 --> 00:24:02,169
and again he was trying to summon up

600
00:24:06,900 --> 00:24:04,120
supernatural entities from within the

601
00:24:09,180 --> 00:24:06,910
Loch and people who visited burlesque in

602
00:24:12,299 --> 00:24:09,190
house said you had this weird atmosphere

603
00:24:13,919 --> 00:24:12,309
and people just got a horrible vibe and

604
00:24:16,620 --> 00:24:13,929
just felt creeped out by it and

605
00:24:18,299 --> 00:24:16,630
certainly to following owners of the

606
00:24:21,090 --> 00:24:18,309
burlesque in house actually committed

607
00:24:23,610 --> 00:24:21,100
suicide one inside the house in the

608
00:24:25,080 --> 00:24:23,620
early 1960s and the other one it was a

609
00:24:27,870 --> 00:24:25,090
famous British actor named George

610
00:24:30,890 --> 00:24:27,880
Sanders he committed suicide in the

611
00:24:33,120 --> 00:24:30,900
early 70s both of them having owned

612
00:24:37,020 --> 00:24:33,130
burlesque in house so you know there was

613
00:24:39,990 --> 00:24:37,030
a a weird vibe there so we also have a

614
00:24:42,659 --> 00:24:40,000
lot of UFO sightings at Loch Ness and

615
00:24:45,240 --> 00:24:42,669
paranormal activity but as far as this

616
00:24:48,120 --> 00:24:45,250
particular dragon cults concerned again

617
00:24:52,200 --> 00:24:48,130
it's a very weird story it relates to

618
00:24:54,930 --> 00:24:52,210
events that began in the late 1960s and

619
00:24:57,419 --> 00:24:54,940
may well have gone on for potentially

620
00:25:01,770 --> 00:24:57,429
years after that but what happened was

621
00:25:04,409 --> 00:25:01,780
that in the summer of 1969 a trio of

622
00:25:05,850 --> 00:25:04,419
American tourists were up at Loch Ness

623
00:25:07,260 --> 00:25:05,860
actually weren't there to look for

624
00:25:07,730 --> 00:25:07,270
Nessie although you know you're not

625
00:25:10,520 --> 00:25:07,740
going to go

626
00:25:12,560 --> 00:25:10,530
lesson not try and find Nessie you know

627
00:25:14,450 --> 00:25:12,570
but their main interest was actually

628
00:25:16,490 --> 00:25:14,460
Aleister Crowley they wanted to see

629
00:25:18,799 --> 00:25:16,500
burlesque in house now

630
00:25:20,990 --> 00:25:18,809
right next to where blessing house used

631
00:25:22,880 --> 00:25:21,000
to stand there's an old cemetery which

632
00:25:25,370 --> 00:25:22,890
goes back years or centuries actually

633
00:25:27,820 --> 00:25:25,380
and it has a history attached to it or

634
00:25:30,049 --> 00:25:27,830
witchcraft which governs and rumors of

635
00:25:33,500 --> 00:25:30,059
sacrifice and all sorts of things going

636
00:25:35,780 --> 00:25:33,510
on there and these three tourists were

637
00:25:37,610 --> 00:25:35,790
walking around the cemetery and they

638
00:25:41,450 --> 00:25:37,620
found what looked like some sort of

639
00:25:43,370 --> 00:25:41,460
carefully folded piece of cloth and when

640
00:25:46,040 --> 00:25:43,380
they opened it up it's actually like a

641
00:25:48,640 --> 00:25:46,050
tapestry about four feet by about five

642
00:25:52,010 --> 00:25:48,650
feet and it was wrapped around a large

643
00:25:53,240 --> 00:25:52,020
seashell and the writing on it they

644
00:25:54,770 --> 00:25:53,250
didn't know it at the time but it was

645
00:25:58,100 --> 00:25:54,780
soon deciphered it turned out to be

646
00:26:01,400 --> 00:25:58,110
Turkish and one of the words translated

647
00:26:03,380 --> 00:26:01,410
as serpent now it so happens that stores

648
00:26:06,110 --> 00:26:03,390
of Lake Monsters in Turkey are quite

649
00:26:09,080 --> 00:26:06,120
prevalent most famous one relates to a

650
00:26:10,760 --> 00:26:09,090
place called Lake van where like Nessie

651
00:26:13,580 --> 00:26:10,770
you know the lake van has a tradition of

652
00:26:17,630 --> 00:26:13,590
a lake monster and there were a lot of

653
00:26:20,930 --> 00:26:17,640
other ritualistic imagery embedded on

654
00:26:22,549 --> 00:26:20,940
this tapestry now this particular piece

655
00:26:24,950 --> 00:26:22,559
of tapestry was shown to a well-known

656
00:26:26,780 --> 00:26:24,960
Loch Ness monster secret of that

657
00:26:30,080 --> 00:26:26,790
particular time in the late 60s named

658
00:26:32,480 --> 00:26:30,090
Ted holiday Ted holiday started going to

659
00:26:35,180 --> 00:26:32,490
Loch Ness in the early 60s and he began

660
00:26:37,669 --> 00:26:35,190
by thinking but he was dealing with like

661
00:26:39,530 --> 00:26:37,679
a colony of unknown animals just

662
00:26:42,169 --> 00:26:39,540
creators that science hadn't found yet

663
00:26:44,330 --> 00:26:42,179
and or even classified but the more that

664
00:26:46,310 --> 00:26:44,340
he dug into it the more he began to

665
00:26:48,169 --> 00:26:46,320
experience like weird synchronicities

666
00:26:50,560 --> 00:26:48,179
and kinda like the collins elite just

667
00:26:52,490 --> 00:26:50,570
strange stuff would overtake him and

668
00:26:55,040 --> 00:26:52,500
there was like this unsettling

669
00:26:57,440 --> 00:26:55,050
atmosphere and he was shown this

670
00:27:01,130 --> 00:26:57,450
tapestry and began to dig into this

671
00:27:03,200 --> 00:27:01,140
story even further and heard whispers

672
00:27:05,840 --> 00:27:03,210
and rumors locally that this dragon

673
00:27:08,780 --> 00:27:05,850
colts had actually been there for years

674
00:27:12,350 --> 00:27:08,790
possibly decades maybe even longer and

675
00:27:14,810 --> 00:27:12,360
that needed catastrophic mistake one of

676
00:27:18,590 --> 00:27:14,820
the members it mistakin lee left that

677
00:27:20,510 --> 00:27:18,600
tapestry where it was after performing

678
00:27:21,650 --> 00:27:20,520
rituals the previous night because the

679
00:27:24,020 --> 00:27:21,660
following morning

680
00:27:25,730 --> 00:27:24,030
where the tapestry was found so Ted

681
00:27:28,730 --> 00:27:25,740
Holliday began looking into this more

682
00:27:31,340 --> 00:27:28,740
and more and came to hear a lot of

683
00:27:34,010 --> 00:27:31,350
disturbing stories like sacrifices not

684
00:27:35,930 --> 00:27:34,020
of animals that of people and he started

685
00:27:37,520 --> 00:27:35,940
looking into stories of you know how

686
00:27:39,710 --> 00:27:37,530
many people in Scotland go missing every

687
00:27:42,980 --> 00:27:39,720
year that kind of thing so he's really

688
00:27:44,870 --> 00:27:42,990
digging deep into this issue and the

689
00:27:47,180 --> 00:27:44,880
boys dog into it the more that Ted

690
00:27:49,789 --> 00:27:47,190
holiday came to believe the Loch Ness

691
00:27:50,720 --> 00:27:49,799
monsters was something supernatural not

692
00:27:53,029 --> 00:27:50,730
flesh and blood

693
00:27:55,190 --> 00:27:53,039
animals that zoology hadn't found or

694
00:27:58,120 --> 00:27:55,200
whatever and he started to have weird

695
00:28:01,520 --> 00:27:58,130
experiences then and it culminated in

696
00:28:03,260 --> 00:28:01,530
1973 when he had an encounter right on

697
00:28:05,270 --> 00:28:03,270
the shores of Loch Ness with nothing

698
00:28:08,240 --> 00:28:05,280
less like a full-blown man in black and

699
00:28:10,940 --> 00:28:08,250
the following year the exact same spot

700
00:28:12,590 --> 00:28:10,950
he had a serious heart attack which he

701
00:28:14,899 --> 00:28:12,600
perceived was like a warning you know to

702
00:28:17,210 --> 00:28:14,909
stay away and he actually didn't and he

703
00:28:19,730 --> 00:28:17,220
died young he died at 59 from another

704
00:28:22,490 --> 00:28:19,740
heart attack so now some people suggest

705
00:28:24,289 --> 00:28:22,500
that all of this came back on him really

706
00:28:27,669 --> 00:28:24,299
but he didn't walk away from it

707
00:28:29,930 --> 00:28:27,679
so the ritual his secret dragon cult the

708
00:28:32,450 --> 00:28:29,940
atmosphere that was already created by

709
00:28:35,210 --> 00:28:32,460
Crowley know some people think it was

710
00:28:38,560 --> 00:28:35,220
right for basic for holiday you know to

711
00:28:42,350 --> 00:28:38,570
sort of be on a doomsday trip almost

712
00:28:45,320 --> 00:28:42,360
damn that is provocative stuff I love it

713
00:28:47,360 --> 00:28:45,330
I also remember we talked about Mac

714
00:28:49,730 --> 00:28:47,370
Tony's and his idea of crypto

715
00:28:51,649 --> 00:28:49,740
terrestrials that these physical aliens

716
00:28:53,720 --> 00:28:51,659
could be more closely tied to the earth

717
00:28:56,210 --> 00:28:53,730
than just some convoy passing through

718
00:28:58,549 --> 00:28:56,220
from another galaxy perhaps an ancient

719
00:29:01,520 --> 00:28:58,559
race living inside the earth and when

720
00:29:03,590 --> 00:29:01,530
you add the magical or spirit realm

721
00:29:05,450 --> 00:29:03,600
element to that I think the case that

722
00:29:09,320 --> 00:29:05,460
these things sit closer to home gets

723
00:29:10,460 --> 00:29:09,330
pretty strong it does really I mean you

724
00:29:12,560 --> 00:29:10,470
know you can look at a lot of these

725
00:29:14,529 --> 00:29:12,570
things where I just like me when I first

726
00:29:16,909 --> 00:29:14,539
got into all this stuff as a kid

727
00:29:18,470 --> 00:29:16,919
everything's black and white as most

728
00:29:20,149 --> 00:29:18,480
things are when you're a kid you know

729
00:29:22,070 --> 00:29:20,159
you don't think too much about the

730
00:29:24,409 --> 00:29:22,080
feasibility of this or that it's like

731
00:29:26,000 --> 00:29:24,419
Santa Claus you don't question what

732
00:29:28,220 --> 00:29:26,010
course he exists you know he comes down

733
00:29:29,480 --> 00:29:28,230
the chimney every Christmas Eve and

734
00:29:31,850 --> 00:29:29,490
phrenic little kids who might be

735
00:29:33,799 --> 00:29:31,860
listening yes he really does

736
00:29:36,590 --> 00:29:33,809
but yeah I mean it's one of these

737
00:29:39,590 --> 00:29:36,600
situations where when you look into

738
00:29:41,060 --> 00:29:39,600
these kind of things and and it is all

739
00:29:43,940 --> 00:29:41,070
black and white to start with but then

740
00:29:46,399 --> 00:29:43,950
the more you look into it you find well

741
00:29:48,860 --> 00:29:46,409
hang on this doesn't seem really logical

742
00:29:51,649 --> 00:29:48,870
and this seems for more feasible that we

743
00:29:54,680 --> 00:29:51,659
are dealing with like a homegrown thing

744
00:29:57,649 --> 00:29:54,690
my view is that a lot of a phenomenon is

745
00:30:00,139 --> 00:29:57,659
not extraterrestrial in the sense it's

746
00:30:01,789 --> 00:30:00,149
coming from multiple star systems

747
00:30:03,940 --> 00:30:01,799
multiple light-years away

748
00:30:05,799 --> 00:30:03,950
but perhaps something that's more

749
00:30:08,240 --> 00:30:05,809
coexists with us you know like

750
00:30:10,430 --> 00:30:08,250
multi-dimensional it's still alien in

751
00:30:14,090 --> 00:30:10,440
one sense but not extraterrestrial alien

752
00:30:16,490 --> 00:30:14,100
it's sort of coexisting alien now max

753
00:30:18,799 --> 00:30:16,500
stuff was interesting as still he's

754
00:30:22,669 --> 00:30:18,809
interesting the idea that there could be

755
00:30:25,820 --> 00:30:22,679
surviving pockets of not us the human

756
00:30:29,379 --> 00:30:25,830
race but something very similar to karma

757
00:30:32,500 --> 00:30:29,389
say pians and that when we started to

758
00:30:35,539 --> 00:30:32,510
infest the planet even more that they

759
00:30:38,480 --> 00:30:35,549
decided to move underground and that

760
00:30:42,139 --> 00:30:38,490
they only surface from time to time and

761
00:30:44,690 --> 00:30:42,149
the perhaps they created the alien UFO

762
00:30:46,250 --> 00:30:44,700
myth as a means if they were seen nobody

763
00:30:48,950 --> 00:30:46,260
would ever guess what they really were

764
00:30:51,379 --> 00:30:48,960
because we were so swamped with the UFO

765
00:30:53,210 --> 00:30:51,389
meme and the alien meme so in other

766
00:30:56,379 --> 00:30:53,220
words they were like a stealthy hidden

767
00:31:00,169 --> 00:30:56,389
society deep below the planet that only

768
00:31:02,480 --> 00:31:00,179
services from time to time but who were

769
00:31:06,139 --> 00:31:02,490
very skillful and adept at camouflage

770
00:31:08,029 --> 00:31:06,149
and subterfuge and making sure that we

771
00:31:10,039 --> 00:31:08,039
never really got on the trail of who and

772
00:31:11,899 --> 00:31:10,049
what they really are and so they put out

773
00:31:14,060 --> 00:31:11,909
these conflicting stories we come from

774
00:31:17,139 --> 00:31:14,070
Mars we come Venus we come from Zeta

775
00:31:20,210 --> 00:31:17,149
Reticuli you know and keep us guessing

776
00:31:21,710 --> 00:31:20,220
only because they knew it they weren't

777
00:31:23,110 --> 00:31:21,720
Superman you know and they knew they

778
00:31:27,860 --> 00:31:23,120
were going to be seen from time to time

779
00:31:30,919 --> 00:31:27,870
so the idea of a secret society of semi

780
00:31:32,539 --> 00:31:30,929
humans might explain something else they

781
00:31:34,220 --> 00:31:32,549
talked about in the book and that's the

782
00:31:36,889 --> 00:31:34,230
men in black mystery which all sounds

783
00:31:38,870 --> 00:31:36,899
like a secret society and atmosphere to

784
00:31:41,450 --> 00:31:38,880
it you know the idea of these creepy

785
00:31:44,450 --> 00:31:41,460
looking guys silencing people of seeing

786
00:31:45,560 --> 00:31:44,460
UFOs but again the witnesses described

787
00:31:47,930 --> 00:31:45,570
them as not looking

788
00:31:50,780 --> 00:31:47,940
entirely human this sort of very pale

789
00:31:52,730 --> 00:31:50,790
their eyes are often described as larger

790
00:31:55,040 --> 00:31:52,740
and steri I don't really seem to

791
00:31:57,500 --> 00:31:55,050
understand and mannerisms and customs

792
00:31:59,570 --> 00:31:57,510
but you know they look enough like

793
00:32:01,130 --> 00:31:59,580
humans where you pass them in the street

794
00:32:03,670 --> 00:32:01,140
perhaps would not look but if you look

795
00:32:06,620 --> 00:32:03,680
really close you would see a lot of odd

796
00:32:08,870 --> 00:32:06,630
angles you know that don't make them not

797
00:32:12,290 --> 00:32:08,880
look like us so in that sense perhaps

798
00:32:15,590 --> 00:32:12,300
the the man in black could be Krypto

799
00:32:17,090 --> 00:32:15,600
terrestrials again sort of trying to

800
00:32:19,790 --> 00:32:17,100
prevent people from getting too close to

801
00:32:22,070 --> 00:32:19,800
the truth of who and what we saw who and

802
00:32:25,070 --> 00:32:22,080
what this secret society actually is you

803
00:32:27,380 --> 00:32:25,080
know yeah great point and I do love

804
00:32:28,940 --> 00:32:27,390
tales of underground cities and

805
00:32:31,370 --> 00:32:28,950
civilizations and you have a great one

806
00:32:34,940 --> 00:32:31,380
in this new book apparently according to

807
00:32:37,550 --> 00:32:34,950
Howard mill in 1931 the sky he had met

808
00:32:39,470 --> 00:32:37,560
dr. s Bruce Russell and his friend fell

809
00:32:43,010 --> 00:32:39,480
into an underground city and death

810
00:32:45,050 --> 00:32:43,020
valley yeah there's actually a number of

811
00:32:47,570 --> 00:32:45,060
stories coming out of death valley I

812
00:32:49,640 --> 00:32:47,580
mean I could have made that section way

813
00:32:51,500 --> 00:32:49,650
longer but I was limited you know two

814
00:32:53,270 --> 00:32:51,510
hundred and fifty thousand words and 200

815
00:32:55,220 --> 00:32:53,280
entries and the publisher would have

816
00:32:58,010 --> 00:32:55,230
gone crazy but attorney like a 200

817
00:33:00,620 --> 00:32:58,020
backers in her book but yeah I mean the

818
00:33:03,800 --> 00:33:00,630
the stories coming out of Death Valley

819
00:33:06,560 --> 00:33:03,810
collectively go back to the early 1920s

820
00:33:09,470 --> 00:33:06,570
and through to the latter part of the

821
00:33:12,410 --> 00:33:09,480
30s and slightly into the early forties

822
00:33:15,290 --> 00:33:12,420
and they're all very similar where you

823
00:33:18,320 --> 00:33:15,300
have people like explorers you know

824
00:33:19,790 --> 00:33:18,330
Indiana Jones types prospectors things

825
00:33:22,550 --> 00:33:19,800
like that you know people looking for

826
00:33:26,480 --> 00:33:22,560
gold and precious items claimed to have

827
00:33:28,610 --> 00:33:26,490
found ways into underground facilities

828
00:33:31,880 --> 00:33:28,620
that sounds quite sophisticated but if

829
00:33:34,880 --> 00:33:31,890
either fell into or discovered old

830
00:33:37,880 --> 00:33:34,890
tunnels caverns some that may have been

831
00:33:39,500 --> 00:33:37,890
carved out some may be natural caverns

832
00:33:41,720 --> 00:33:39,510
that at all the time have been sort of

833
00:33:43,640 --> 00:33:41,730
carefully hidden we've just got small

834
00:33:44,840 --> 00:33:43,650
entrances and exits and that you

835
00:33:46,850 --> 00:33:44,850
wouldn't really know where they work

836
00:33:49,130 --> 00:33:46,860
they were sort of carefully concealed

837
00:33:51,170 --> 00:33:49,140
but the stories typically relate how

838
00:33:53,180 --> 00:33:51,180
these various prospectors and

839
00:33:56,480 --> 00:33:53,190
archaeologists and adventurers and

840
00:33:58,160 --> 00:33:56,490
explorers made their way way way deep

841
00:33:59,420 --> 00:33:58,170
down under the ground you know it could

842
00:34:01,430 --> 00:33:59,430
be talking like from

843
00:34:04,670 --> 00:34:01,440
mile after mile more than that maybe and

844
00:34:07,430 --> 00:34:04,680
coming across what looked like the

845
00:34:09,950 --> 00:34:07,440
remnants of ancient societies now of

846
00:34:12,050 --> 00:34:09,960
course if that's true the idea that

847
00:34:14,330 --> 00:34:12,060
there could be deep under the California

848
00:34:16,190 --> 00:34:14,340
desert the equivalent of the some of

849
00:34:18,280 --> 00:34:16,200
them described almost as like Greek

850
00:34:22,220 --> 00:34:18,290
architecture and Roman architecture

851
00:34:25,640 --> 00:34:22,230
temples you know pillars and statues and

852
00:34:27,890 --> 00:34:25,650
massive ancient rooms if that's true

853
00:34:29,540 --> 00:34:27,900
then it would massively alter the

854
00:34:32,270 --> 00:34:29,550
history of the United States the idea

855
00:34:36,050 --> 00:34:32,280
that there was some sort of super race

856
00:34:37,640 --> 00:34:36,060
that existed way before us but there are

857
00:34:40,550 --> 00:34:37,650
a number of rumors that some of the

858
00:34:44,240 --> 00:34:40,560
people who made their way into these

859
00:34:46,790 --> 00:34:44,250
caverns and caves in a very really weird

860
00:34:48,500 --> 00:34:46,800
an eerie and creepy way they found

861
00:34:51,470 --> 00:34:48,510
themselves being followed and watched

862
00:34:53,930 --> 00:34:51,480
very often late at night by these people

863
00:34:55,190 --> 00:34:53,940
that with hindsight again kind of sound

864
00:34:55,730 --> 00:34:55,200
like the men in black where they would

865
00:34:57,710 --> 00:34:55,740
wear these

866
00:34:59,360 --> 00:34:57,720
pull down hats and come out at night and

867
00:35:02,380 --> 00:34:59,370
you me understand so well

868
00:35:04,940 --> 00:35:02,390
but these people were being followed and

869
00:35:06,950 --> 00:35:04,950
occasionally they would cross paths with

870
00:35:09,740 --> 00:35:06,960
these people who would their glare at

871
00:35:11,720 --> 00:35:09,750
them you know is it to say we know what

872
00:35:15,260 --> 00:35:11,730
you're doing and stop you know don't

873
00:35:17,480 --> 00:35:15,270
come back to our realm and in some cases

874
00:35:20,030 --> 00:35:17,490
it was like I mean a literal threat it

875
00:35:22,310 --> 00:35:20,040
was whatever you know just stop right

876
00:35:23,690 --> 00:35:22,320
now you know nothing else will happen to

877
00:35:25,670 --> 00:35:23,700
you so you know you've got a lot of

878
00:35:28,790 --> 00:35:25,680
weird stories about these people looking

879
00:35:30,530 --> 00:35:28,800
into these underground areas and then

880
00:35:31,970 --> 00:35:30,540
finding themselves you know looking out

881
00:35:33,620 --> 00:35:31,980
the window late at night and there's

882
00:35:36,230 --> 00:35:33,630
these three shadowy figures or whatever

883
00:35:38,630 --> 00:35:36,240
looking up at the window as if just try

884
00:35:40,910 --> 00:35:38,640
to intimidate them kind of saying we

885
00:35:41,870 --> 00:35:40,920
know what you saw leave it alone that

886
00:35:45,110 --> 00:35:41,880
kind of thing

887
00:35:47,600 --> 00:35:45,120
that's great love it yeah of course

888
00:35:50,450 --> 00:35:47,610
Antarctica has been the topic of much

889
00:35:51,980 --> 00:35:50,460
speculation kind of in this realm and

890
00:35:54,350 --> 00:35:51,990
I'm not sure if you've been seeing this

891
00:35:55,700 --> 00:35:54,360
crazy list of people who are going down

892
00:35:57,470 --> 00:35:55,710
there for some reason but just in the

893
00:35:59,420 --> 00:35:57,480
past few months John Kerry went down

894
00:36:02,240 --> 00:35:59,430
there as Secretary of State as well as

895
00:36:05,240 --> 00:36:02,250
this russian orthodox patriarch of

896
00:36:08,170 --> 00:36:05,250
Moscow this Carroll the third and also

897
00:36:10,580 --> 00:36:08,180
Buzz Aldrin and it really does seem like

898
00:36:13,420 --> 00:36:10,590
the possibilities they might have found

899
00:36:16,440 --> 00:36:13,430
something that a privileged few are

900
00:36:19,390 --> 00:36:16,450
invited to see religious political and

901
00:36:20,740 --> 00:36:19,400
space elite well yeah I mean it's

902
00:36:24,220 --> 00:36:20,750
interesting because a lot of those

903
00:36:27,579 --> 00:36:24,230
themes science technology religion

904
00:36:29,650 --> 00:36:27,589
history secret places secret groups all

905
00:36:31,960 --> 00:36:29,660
of those are sort of staple parts of

906
00:36:35,230 --> 00:36:31,970
secret society you know whether they

907
00:36:36,339 --> 00:36:35,240
were an official secret group or not but

908
00:36:38,559 --> 00:36:36,349
yet I mean there are a lot of weird

909
00:36:41,230 --> 00:36:38,569
stories coming out of Antarctica and the

910
00:36:43,480 --> 00:36:41,240
have been for decades there's long been

911
00:36:45,490 --> 00:36:43,490
these rumors that deep below the ice

912
00:36:47,160 --> 00:36:45,500
before that part of the planet was

913
00:36:51,040 --> 00:36:47,170
covered in ice there may well have been

914
00:36:53,859 --> 00:36:51,050
just regular land masses and so that was

915
00:36:56,260 --> 00:36:53,869
the case then even if the massive ice

916
00:36:58,180 --> 00:36:56,270
floes came up and just overwhelmed the

917
00:37:00,790 --> 00:36:58,190
landscape as you would know if there was

918
00:37:03,250 --> 00:37:00,800
like an ice age but you might find that

919
00:37:05,710 --> 00:37:03,260
ten thousand years after the ice age and

920
00:37:07,780 --> 00:37:05,720
the ice is still there you know 300 feet

921
00:37:09,700 --> 00:37:07,790
down you still got the remnants of the

922
00:37:13,420 --> 00:37:09,710
you know the rubble of what was once New

923
00:37:16,210 --> 00:37:13,430
York or LA or whatever but it's such an

924
00:37:18,430 --> 00:37:16,220
impenetrable kind of landscape that no

925
00:37:20,500 --> 00:37:18,440
one would ever know so I do sometimes

926
00:37:23,049 --> 00:37:20,510
wonder if that might be the case with

927
00:37:25,539 --> 00:37:23,059
things like Antarctica I'm not really a

928
00:37:28,180 --> 00:37:25,549
big fan of the idea you know that there

929
00:37:31,180 --> 00:37:28,190
are these gigantic alien bases deep

930
00:37:33,400 --> 00:37:31,190
below Antarctica but what I do think is

931
00:37:36,760 --> 00:37:33,410
possible he's like I said that before

932
00:37:39,970 --> 00:37:36,770
we've had the successive ice ages that

933
00:37:42,460 --> 00:37:39,980
maybe that area was regular territory

934
00:37:46,299 --> 00:37:42,470
just normal environment and he was

935
00:37:48,670 --> 00:37:46,309
overwhelmed by ice and maybe that might

936
00:37:50,349 --> 00:37:48,680
explain if something to be found that

937
00:37:53,319 --> 00:37:50,359
would make sense if there are remnants

938
00:37:55,240 --> 00:37:53,329
of that earlier civilization skill in

939
00:37:57,730 --> 00:37:55,250
that particular area mm-hmm

940
00:37:59,920 --> 00:37:57,740
I mean human history is a lot longer and

941
00:38:01,420 --> 00:37:59,930
stranger than we've been told it seems I

942
00:38:03,400 --> 00:38:01,430
mean the evidence seems to suggest that

943
00:38:05,049 --> 00:38:03,410
and Antarctica is the fifth largest

944
00:38:07,210 --> 00:38:05,059
continent you'd expect there to be

945
00:38:08,859 --> 00:38:07,220
something interesting worth digging up

946
00:38:11,140 --> 00:38:08,869
I've heard some people suggest that

947
00:38:13,299 --> 00:38:11,150
maybe even Atlantis with a city on

948
00:38:15,880 --> 00:38:13,309
Antarctica and that this whole continent

949
00:38:18,370 --> 00:38:15,890
I mean it is technically underwater so

950
00:38:19,660 --> 00:38:18,380
maybe there is something to that yeah I

951
00:38:22,030 --> 00:38:19,670
mean it wouldn't surprise me because

952
00:38:25,030 --> 00:38:22,040
because if you imagine the people talked

953
00:38:26,880 --> 00:38:25,040
about another Ice Age and how some of

954
00:38:29,099 --> 00:38:26,890
the early ones things have happened

955
00:38:32,069 --> 00:38:29,109
most inexplicably quickly if there's a

956
00:38:34,829 --> 00:38:32,079
sudden alteration in the atmosphere or

957
00:38:36,630 --> 00:38:34,839
the environment but you know I come back

958
00:38:39,089 --> 00:38:36,640
to that issue if you imagine something

959
00:38:42,029 --> 00:38:39,099
like literature State New York you know

960
00:38:43,319 --> 00:38:42,039
overwhelmed by ice sheets hundreds and

961
00:38:45,359 --> 00:38:43,329
hundreds of feet deep

962
00:38:48,029 --> 00:38:45,369
pummeled all the buildings flattened

963
00:38:51,029 --> 00:38:48,039
them people died the building's over

964
00:38:53,009 --> 00:38:51,039
time just became so degraded in terms of

965
00:38:54,630 --> 00:38:53,019
rubble and we're talking over periods of

966
00:38:56,910 --> 00:38:54,640
thousands of years so that really

967
00:38:59,099 --> 00:38:56,920
wouldn't be much left beyond what you

968
00:39:01,980 --> 00:38:59,109
would find at an archaeological dig but

969
00:39:03,900 --> 00:39:01,990
Stonehenge or somewhere like that so I

970
00:39:07,079 --> 00:39:03,910
could see how something could be found

971
00:39:09,329 --> 00:39:07,089
and maybe plans would be would be

972
00:39:12,029 --> 00:39:09,339
undertaken secretly probably to dig

973
00:39:14,359 --> 00:39:12,039
further into Antarctica to dig down you

974
00:39:18,000 --> 00:39:14,369
know actually see if there's any way to

975
00:39:21,120 --> 00:39:18,010
penetrate what we perceive as Antarctica

976
00:39:22,890 --> 00:39:21,130
today and try and figure out we keep

977
00:39:25,829 --> 00:39:22,900
going down and keep going down and down

978
00:39:29,190 --> 00:39:25,839
are we going to find evidence of a race

979
00:39:31,920 --> 00:39:29,200
whether Atlanteans or or whatever that

980
00:39:34,559 --> 00:39:31,930
once lived there and maybe kind of like

981
00:39:36,630 --> 00:39:34,569
Mack Tony's script so terrestrials

982
00:39:37,519 --> 00:39:36,640
perhaps they fled the area when they

983
00:39:39,960 --> 00:39:37,529
knew what was happening

984
00:39:42,599 --> 00:39:39,970
started over somewhere else and have

985
00:39:44,700 --> 00:39:42,609
seen the ice floes maybe that dictated

986
00:39:46,799 --> 00:39:44,710
why they decide to go underground for

987
00:39:49,740 --> 00:39:46,809
fear that what happened was going to

988
00:39:51,960 --> 00:39:49,750
happen to the entire planet yeah if we

989
00:39:53,549 --> 00:39:51,970
ever were on that landmass it would be a

990
00:39:55,980 --> 00:39:53,559
good place to try and unearth things

991
00:39:58,170 --> 00:39:55,990
from the ancient world which also does

992
00:39:59,999 --> 00:39:58,180
seem to be a subtext of the constant

993
00:40:02,009 --> 00:40:00,009
battling in the Middle East to bring it

994
00:40:04,349 --> 00:40:02,019
back to a topic from your latest book

995
00:40:06,599 --> 00:40:04,359
you talk about an immortality group

996
00:40:09,180 --> 00:40:06,609
based in Utah that might have sprung up

997
00:40:13,109 --> 00:40:09,190
around some ancient things found in

998
00:40:14,880 --> 00:40:13,119
Baghdad after the Iraq invasion yeah

999
00:40:17,130 --> 00:40:14,890
this is like a really weird story

1000
00:40:20,009 --> 00:40:17,140
because you know when the invasion of

1001
00:40:22,559 --> 00:40:20,019
Iraq occurred rumors started to fly

1002
00:40:25,710 --> 00:40:22,569
around that although you know the

1003
00:40:28,740 --> 00:40:25,720
primary reason was to oust Saddam

1004
00:40:31,170 --> 00:40:28,750
Hussein the theory is that he also acted

1005
00:40:34,109 --> 00:40:31,180
as a cover for a great deal of other

1006
00:40:36,180 --> 00:40:34,119
things now one of the key events that

1007
00:40:39,839 --> 00:40:36,190
happened when the invasion of Baghdad

1008
00:40:40,650 --> 00:40:39,849
occurred was the looting of the Baghdad

1009
00:40:43,980 --> 00:40:40,660
Museum

1010
00:40:47,160 --> 00:40:43,990
and the museum you know thankfully sort

1011
00:40:50,099 --> 00:40:47,170
of been rectified etc now but the museum

1012
00:40:53,069 --> 00:40:50,109
was home to I mean literally thousands

1013
00:40:55,920 --> 00:40:53,079
and thousands of priceless artifacts but

1014
00:40:58,620 --> 00:40:55,930
when the military went in they realized

1015
00:41:00,660 --> 00:40:58,630
in conjunction with these staff who they

1016
00:41:02,670 --> 00:41:00,670
were working with that it didn't look

1017
00:41:05,670 --> 00:41:02,680
like but these were sort of randoms

1018
00:41:08,190 --> 00:41:05,680
Anarchy driven rioting and pillaging and

1019
00:41:10,170 --> 00:41:08,200
looting it seems that the people who had

1020
00:41:12,089 --> 00:41:10,180
done this had done their best to make it

1021
00:41:14,880 --> 00:41:12,099
look like that but they'd actually

1022
00:41:17,809 --> 00:41:14,890
specifically targeted certain areas of

1023
00:41:21,210 --> 00:41:17,819
the museum where some intriguing

1024
00:41:23,309 --> 00:41:21,220
artifacts were supposedly kept now one

1025
00:41:25,849 --> 00:41:23,319
of the rumors was that some of this

1026
00:41:28,410 --> 00:41:25,859
material evidence was ancient

1027
00:41:31,170 --> 00:41:28,420
extraterrestrial technology there was

1028
00:41:33,690 --> 00:41:31,180
somehow linked to the legends of like

1029
00:41:36,089 --> 00:41:33,700
for example King Gilgamesh whose kingdom

1030
00:41:38,910 --> 00:41:36,099
was in what is today Iraq is place

1031
00:41:41,190 --> 00:41:38,920
called oberek and if you read the epic

1032
00:41:42,930 --> 00:41:41,200
of gilgamesh he talks about how he's

1033
00:41:44,609 --> 00:41:42,940
really sound completely human he was

1034
00:41:47,039 --> 00:41:44,619
like a classic one of the you know the

1035
00:41:49,440 --> 00:41:47,049
ancient Giants of the Bible things like

1036
00:41:50,910 --> 00:41:49,450
that and Gilgamesh supposedly reigned

1037
00:41:53,670 --> 00:41:50,920
for like a hundred and thirty years

1038
00:41:56,160 --> 00:41:53,680
which is true you know he clearly wasn't

1039
00:42:00,349 --> 00:41:56,170
entirely human but he apparently had an

1040
00:42:03,180 --> 00:42:00,359
obsessive quest to understand and

1041
00:42:04,380 --> 00:42:03,190
capture the secrets of immortality

1042
00:42:05,940 --> 00:42:04,390
that's according you know let's have the

1043
00:42:09,150 --> 00:42:05,950
basics of the story of the Epic of

1044
00:42:11,910 --> 00:42:09,160
Gilgamesh and the theory is somebody

1045
00:42:14,970 --> 00:42:11,920
some elite group went in to try and find

1046
00:42:18,450 --> 00:42:14,980
these ancient alien artifacts with a

1047
00:42:20,309 --> 00:42:18,460
means to try and provide sort of global

1048
00:42:23,940 --> 00:42:20,319
elite with immortality you know by

1049
00:42:26,549 --> 00:42:23,950
finding this ancient technology and this

1050
00:42:28,829 --> 00:42:26,559
then follows over into this story that

1051
00:42:31,069 --> 00:42:28,839
when I wrote the book I actually only

1052
00:42:33,240 --> 00:42:31,079
had one source that related to me I

1053
00:42:35,430 --> 00:42:33,250
predominately put the story out to see

1054
00:42:36,359 --> 00:42:35,440
if anybody else could sort of confirm it

1055
00:42:38,220 --> 00:42:36,369
you know when you hit a brick wall

1056
00:42:40,890 --> 00:42:38,230
sometimes that's what you have to do you

1057
00:42:42,390 --> 00:42:40,900
have to just pull it out and since the

1058
00:42:45,029 --> 00:42:42,400
book came out it actually had three

1059
00:42:47,880 --> 00:42:45,039
people who provided other snippets and

1060
00:42:49,710 --> 00:42:47,890
all of them interesting enough so well

1061
00:42:51,839 --> 00:42:49,720
yeah the group didn't exist you looked

1062
00:42:54,570 --> 00:42:51,849
into it but I didn't really get very far

1063
00:42:56,190 --> 00:42:54,580
with it now if they're all lying

1064
00:42:58,020 --> 00:42:56,200
granted again this is speculation if

1065
00:42:59,820 --> 00:42:58,030
they were lying I think they probably

1066
00:43:02,370 --> 00:42:59,830
would have said oh yeah all work great

1067
00:43:03,960 --> 00:43:02,380
you know and this elite have got it

1068
00:43:06,540 --> 00:43:03,970
because it would amp up the excitement

1069
00:43:08,490 --> 00:43:06,550
but they basically said well yeah they

1070
00:43:10,680 --> 00:43:08,500
did have these artifacts they did have

1071
00:43:13,320 --> 00:43:10,690
these ancient texts and material

1072
00:43:15,750 --> 00:43:13,330
evidence but nobody got anywhere with it

1073
00:43:16,080 --> 00:43:15,760
and apparently they're still working on

1074
00:43:20,820 --> 00:43:16,090
it

1075
00:43:23,280 --> 00:43:20,830
to me that says more believable than

1076
00:43:25,380 --> 00:43:23,290
spinning a wild story you know what I

1077
00:43:27,630 --> 00:43:25,390
mean yeah so ironically the fact that

1078
00:43:30,480 --> 00:43:27,640
the program didn't work to me at least

1079
00:43:32,310 --> 00:43:30,490
adds weight to what the informants told

1080
00:43:35,400 --> 00:43:32,320
me but yeah it was I was never told

1081
00:43:37,070 --> 00:43:35,410
specifically where in Utah this was

1082
00:43:39,720 --> 00:43:37,080
going on but it was described as like a

1083
00:43:42,870 --> 00:43:39,730
classified fortified place on the ground

1084
00:43:45,240 --> 00:43:42,880
which kind of provokes imagery of the

1085
00:43:47,160 --> 00:43:45,250
Dugway proving ground in Utah which does

1086
00:43:50,160 --> 00:43:47,170
a lot of secret research into like

1087
00:43:52,440 --> 00:43:50,170
viruses and chemical warfare so for them

1088
00:43:55,020 --> 00:43:52,450
to have an underground facility there

1089
00:43:58,290 --> 00:43:55,030
which Dugway does he wouldn't surprise

1090
00:44:00,300 --> 00:43:58,300
me if it operated out of Dugway but also

1091
00:44:02,760 --> 00:44:00,310
it sounds a little bit not unlike the

1092
00:44:05,640 --> 00:44:02,770
Colin C leak because apparently this

1093
00:44:07,500 --> 00:44:05,650
group out in Utah was also rereading

1094
00:44:09,240 --> 00:44:07,510
things like the Epic of Gilgamesh and a

1095
00:44:12,450 --> 00:44:09,250
lot of other ancient texts to try and

1096
00:44:14,700 --> 00:44:12,460
figure out the truth of immortality so I

1097
00:44:16,410 --> 00:44:14,710
think there's more to this story but

1098
00:44:18,000 --> 00:44:16,420
whether or not anything's being achieved

1099
00:44:21,120 --> 00:44:18,010
you know that that's an entirely

1100
00:44:24,180 --> 00:44:21,130
different aspect but we need far more

1101
00:44:25,350 --> 00:44:24,190
evidence for that yeah for a second

1102
00:44:27,270 --> 00:44:25,360
there I thought they had something

1103
00:44:29,390 --> 00:44:27,280
figured out when you look at the ages of

1104
00:44:32,160 --> 00:44:29,400
a lot of the elite class but then

1105
00:44:33,780 --> 00:44:32,170
Rockefeller kicked the can apparently on

1106
00:44:36,450 --> 00:44:33,790
the Solstice there so maybe they had

1107
00:44:38,520 --> 00:44:36,460
some more work to do well yeah I mean

1108
00:44:41,160 --> 00:44:38,530
it's one of these things where if we're

1109
00:44:44,220 --> 00:44:41,170
going to be immortal you don't want to

1110
00:44:45,810 --> 00:44:44,230
be living to 800 but you stop aging when

1111
00:44:49,380 --> 00:44:45,820
you're 75 you know then you go to live

1112
00:44:51,930 --> 00:44:49,390
700 years at the age of 75 I mean most

1113
00:44:53,880 --> 00:44:51,940
people would say well you know just fix

1114
00:44:56,250 --> 00:44:53,890
it so that it I'm going to be 30 for the

1115
00:44:59,910 --> 00:44:56,260
next 2,000 years and then we'll do you

1116
00:45:02,640 --> 00:44:59,920
know so I think you know immortality we

1117
00:45:05,130 --> 00:45:02,650
actually know why we age you know just

1118
00:45:08,220 --> 00:45:05,140
basically due to the division of cells

1119
00:45:10,380 --> 00:45:08,230
and when they stop dividing properly

1120
00:45:13,140 --> 00:45:10,390
body started to degrade you get old etc

1121
00:45:15,750 --> 00:45:13,150
etc but we understand why that happens

1122
00:45:18,270 --> 00:45:15,760
but if we could find a way to halt it or

1123
00:45:20,940 --> 00:45:18,280
reverse it that in theory mortality

1124
00:45:23,430 --> 00:45:20,950
isn't just a pipe dream or a fantasy

1125
00:45:25,080 --> 00:45:23,440
could actually be achieved we just don't

1126
00:45:28,650 --> 00:45:25,090
have the technology yet so far as we

1127
00:45:30,150 --> 00:45:28,660
know to do it but you know it's not

1128
00:45:31,640 --> 00:45:30,160
impossible that it could happen of

1129
00:45:33,990 --> 00:45:31,650
course then the big question is well

1130
00:45:36,870 --> 00:45:34,000
would it be made available to everybody

1131
00:45:38,910 --> 00:45:36,880
or would some sort of global elite be

1132
00:45:41,910 --> 00:45:38,920
the only ones who would know and perhaps

1133
00:45:44,040 --> 00:45:41,920
when they got to a certain age the story

1134
00:45:45,990 --> 00:45:44,050
put out that they died but they just

1135
00:45:49,020 --> 00:45:46,000
they didn't actually die you know they

1136
00:45:51,570 --> 00:45:49,030
just live in sort of a clandestine place

1137
00:45:53,040 --> 00:45:51,580
whatever or location so where no one

1138
00:45:56,250 --> 00:45:53,050
would know they're actually still living

1139
00:45:58,020 --> 00:45:56,260
and living and living and living yeah

1140
00:46:00,570 --> 00:45:58,030
well I mean that is some of the

1141
00:46:02,340 --> 00:46:00,580
conspiratorial speculation around David

1142
00:46:04,320 --> 00:46:02,350
Rockefellers death because it was

1143
00:46:07,230 --> 00:46:04,330
announced on that solstice which is a

1144
00:46:08,820 --> 00:46:07,240
kind of a ritualistic date but you know

1145
00:46:10,650 --> 00:46:08,830
you're right about that

1146
00:46:12,210 --> 00:46:10,660
you want a young vessel I don't think

1147
00:46:16,710 --> 00:46:12,220
he's doing cartwheels down there

1148
00:46:19,650 --> 00:46:16,720
anything no man so another thing I want

1149
00:46:23,040 --> 00:46:19,660
to ask you about is uncracked codes this

1150
00:46:25,320 --> 00:46:23,050
cicada 3301 saga in particular pretty

1151
00:46:26,640 --> 00:46:25,330
interesting story I've talked about it a

1152
00:46:28,980 --> 00:46:26,650
little bit before but what can you tell

1153
00:46:32,370 --> 00:46:28,990
us about that this is one of these

1154
00:46:34,530 --> 00:46:32,380
situations where we find a secret

1155
00:46:37,260 --> 00:46:34,540
society or even a secret society where

1156
00:46:40,530 --> 00:46:37,270
we sort of so baffled by the existence

1157
00:46:44,070 --> 00:46:40,540
of it but it does exist now if you can

1158
00:46:47,270 --> 00:46:44,080
call Kikaider 3301 and basically what's

1159
00:46:50,970 --> 00:46:47,280
happened is that between 2012 and 2016

1160
00:46:53,340 --> 00:46:50,980
these strange puzzles have been placed

1161
00:46:55,349 --> 00:46:53,350
online and people have been encouraged

1162
00:46:58,230 --> 00:46:55,359
to essentially try and crack these codes

1163
00:47:00,780 --> 00:46:58,240
and all sorts of theories are being put

1164
00:47:03,270 --> 00:47:00,790
forward as to who this group this

1165
00:47:05,880 --> 00:47:03,280
clandestine group is and how and why

1166
00:47:08,040 --> 00:47:05,890
they're doing this now one of the

1167
00:47:10,859 --> 00:47:08,050
interesting theories is that it's

1168
00:47:13,710 --> 00:47:10,869
actually some kind of intelligence

1169
00:47:16,680 --> 00:47:13,720
agency whether of the US or the UK or

1170
00:47:19,440 --> 00:47:16,690
who knows and they're looking for highly

1171
00:47:22,050 --> 00:47:19,450
skilled people who can are brilliant and

1172
00:47:24,690 --> 00:47:22,060
cracking cold deciphering codes and

1173
00:47:27,870 --> 00:47:24,700
so they put a challenge out which seems

1174
00:47:30,960 --> 00:47:27,880
kind of like an exciting fun thing to do

1175
00:47:32,700 --> 00:47:30,970
but at its heart might be you know

1176
00:47:35,610 --> 00:47:32,710
something that relates to national

1177
00:47:36,510 --> 00:47:35,620
security and government secrecy and that

1178
00:47:38,910 --> 00:47:36,520
kind of thing

1179
00:47:40,440 --> 00:47:38,920
for example when this first surfaced

1180
00:47:42,510 --> 00:47:40,450
again one of the reasons why I included

1181
00:47:45,620 --> 00:47:42,520
this in the book shows because Britain's

1182
00:47:48,450 --> 00:47:45,630
Daily Telegraph newspaper actually

1183
00:47:50,490 --> 00:47:48,460
speculated that it was either the

1184
00:47:52,830 --> 00:47:50,500
Illuminati or the Freemasons that were

1185
00:47:55,650 --> 00:47:52,840
doing this so in other words you have a

1186
00:47:58,080 --> 00:47:55,660
lot of different theories and what of

1187
00:47:59,760 --> 00:47:58,090
Sahai profile magazines and newspapers

1188
00:48:02,100 --> 00:47:59,770
have covered this like for example

1189
00:48:05,280 --> 00:48:02,110
Rolling Stone magazine they gave it

1190
00:48:07,650 --> 00:48:05,290
major coverage now one of the things

1191
00:48:11,040 --> 00:48:07,660
that Rolling Stone magazine found out

1192
00:48:13,560 --> 00:48:11,050
was they dug into it was that a 2013

1193
00:48:17,190 --> 00:48:13,570
version of one of these codes that came

1194
00:48:20,280 --> 00:48:17,200
out was actually a cipher based on one

1195
00:48:22,260 --> 00:48:20,290
of Aleister Crowley's writings so again

1196
00:48:25,860 --> 00:48:22,270
you know we have this going back to -

1197
00:48:28,650 --> 00:48:25,870
Crowley and you also had like Britain's

1198
00:48:31,170 --> 00:48:28,660
GCHQ which is the British equivalents of

1199
00:48:32,760 --> 00:48:31,180
the NSA and the rumors that they might

1200
00:48:35,280 --> 00:48:32,770
have been involved in again trying to

1201
00:48:37,620 --> 00:48:35,290
find people to recruit and people who

1202
00:48:39,990 --> 00:48:37,630
were perhaps a little bit alternative

1203
00:48:42,030 --> 00:48:40,000
and who thought outside the box but to

1204
00:48:44,340 --> 00:48:42,040
this day we don't really know so one end

1205
00:48:47,310 --> 00:48:44,350
of the spectrum you've got people like

1206
00:48:49,260 --> 00:48:47,320
the NSA or GCHQ and at the other end

1207
00:48:52,410 --> 00:48:49,270
you've got Aleister Crowley and

1208
00:48:54,210 --> 00:48:52,420
Freemasons and the Illuminati and other

1209
00:48:56,190 --> 00:48:54,220
people are somewhere balanced between

1210
00:48:59,790 --> 00:48:56,200
the two so it's a very intriguing

1211
00:49:01,620 --> 00:48:59,800
mystery that's still going on well any

1212
00:49:04,170 --> 00:49:01,630
good mystery is going to touch on all

1213
00:49:06,360 --> 00:49:04,180
those buzzwords and grooves for sure but

1214
00:49:09,210 --> 00:49:06,370
this part of it was new to me this is

1215
00:49:11,280 --> 00:49:09,220
from your book you say in November 2013

1216
00:49:14,160 --> 00:49:11,290
a message left anonymously on the

1217
00:49:16,140 --> 00:49:14,170
website pastebin came from someone who

1218
00:49:18,600 --> 00:49:16,150
claimed to have been brought in from a

1219
00:49:21,570 --> 00:49:18,610
superior in the military and said that

1220
00:49:24,270 --> 00:49:21,580
the cicada group was a left-hand path

1221
00:49:27,180 --> 00:49:24,280
religion disguised as a progressive

1222
00:49:29,280 --> 00:49:27,190
scientific organization comprised of

1223
00:49:31,500 --> 00:49:29,290
military officers diplomats and

1224
00:49:33,690 --> 00:49:31,510
academics who are dissatisfied with the

1225
00:49:35,290 --> 00:49:33,700
direction of the world well we've heard

1226
00:49:36,700 --> 00:49:35,300
that before haven't we

1227
00:49:40,060 --> 00:49:36,710
well you know that it's interesting

1228
00:49:42,370 --> 00:49:40,070
because again to some degree that sounds

1229
00:49:43,960 --> 00:49:42,380
a little bit like the Collins elite and

1230
00:49:45,550 --> 00:49:43,970
they were sort of you know getting

1231
00:49:48,010 --> 00:49:45,560
bigger and bigger you know as you said

1232
00:49:49,750 --> 00:49:48,020
it's a left-hand path religion described

1233
00:49:52,090 --> 00:49:49,760
as this scientific organization

1234
00:49:54,460 --> 00:49:52,100
comprised of military people diplomats

1235
00:49:56,440 --> 00:49:54,470
academics which mean a lot of academics

1236
00:49:59,340 --> 00:49:56,450
are brought into the Collins elite

1237
00:50:03,330 --> 00:49:59,350
you're not as members but as consultants

1238
00:50:06,430 --> 00:50:03,340
so in other words we can find a lot of

1239
00:50:10,030 --> 00:50:06,440
parallels and linkages between these

1240
00:50:12,910 --> 00:50:10,040
groups suggesting that they're all part

1241
00:50:15,040 --> 00:50:12,920
and parcel of some bigger umbrella and

1242
00:50:16,660 --> 00:50:15,050
we're sort of looking at them thinking

1243
00:50:20,010 --> 00:50:16,670
or assuming that what we're dealing with

1244
00:50:24,160 --> 00:50:20,020
is multiple completely independent

1245
00:50:26,410 --> 00:50:24,170
organizations but in reality have you

1246
00:50:28,450 --> 00:50:26,420
know like a central hub when you find

1247
00:50:31,600 --> 00:50:28,460
these connections with Crowley and

1248
00:50:33,280 --> 00:50:31,610
demonology and secret societies and

1249
00:50:35,620 --> 00:50:33,290
powerful people in governments and the

1250
00:50:37,540 --> 00:50:35,630
military you know this even sort of ties

1251
00:50:40,480 --> 00:50:37,550
him like I said with a you know the

1252
00:50:42,670 --> 00:50:40,490
Iraqi issues so put all those together I

1253
00:50:45,520 --> 00:50:42,680
think a good case can be made that many

1254
00:50:49,300 --> 00:50:45,530
of these secret societies are part of a

1255
00:50:51,790 --> 00:50:49,310
much larger single secret society right

1256
00:50:55,330 --> 00:50:51,800
yeah some like Kenny's they are spider

1257
00:50:58,150 --> 00:50:55,340
web out yeah and there's a lot of people

1258
00:51:00,400 --> 00:50:58,160
that think just this past presidential

1259
00:51:02,380 --> 00:51:00,410
election is the result of some kind of

1260
00:51:04,420 --> 00:51:02,390
powerful underground network making a

1261
00:51:06,730 --> 00:51:04,430
move from within the deep state and I've

1262
00:51:09,040 --> 00:51:06,740
even heard some say that they think the

1263
00:51:11,920 --> 00:51:09,050
cicada puzzles were a recruitment tool

1264
00:51:14,080 --> 00:51:11,930
to find just the sorts of people with

1265
00:51:17,440 --> 00:51:14,090
the technical skills to facilitate such

1266
00:51:20,020 --> 00:51:17,450
a thing yeah I've got to be honest I

1267
00:51:21,700 --> 00:51:20,030
haven't heard that one but I mean that

1268
00:51:23,830 --> 00:51:21,710
there's no debe sort of Kikaider you

1269
00:51:25,720 --> 00:51:23,840
know it's a major talking point there's

1270
00:51:28,090 --> 00:51:25,730
no doubt about that and certainly

1271
00:51:29,980 --> 00:51:28,100
agencies have picked up on it you know

1272
00:51:32,200 --> 00:51:29,990
perhaps an agency that knows nothing

1273
00:51:33,640 --> 00:51:32,210
about it but wants to know about it and

1274
00:51:36,160 --> 00:51:33,650
I think that's one of the things that

1275
00:51:38,470 --> 00:51:36,170
certainly politics demonstrates to us

1276
00:51:39,700 --> 00:51:38,480
that the left and the right hand don't

1277
00:51:41,470 --> 00:51:39,710
always know what each other are doing

1278
00:51:44,260 --> 00:51:41,480
and there are secret little cliques

1279
00:51:46,510 --> 00:51:44,270
within political parties and somebody's

1280
00:51:48,700 --> 00:51:46,520
working for somebody else and and it

1281
00:51:49,810 --> 00:51:48,710
gets really complicated you know I'm

1282
00:51:52,270 --> 00:51:49,820
you only have to look at the Russia

1283
00:51:53,650 --> 00:51:52,280
thing right now to see that's not

1284
00:51:56,410 --> 00:51:53,660
necessarily enemies every secret

1285
00:51:59,470 --> 00:51:56,420
societies obviously but you can just see

1286
00:52:01,870 --> 00:51:59,480
how it becomes so complicated and just

1287
00:52:04,210 --> 00:52:01,880
filled with intrigue because people just

1288
00:52:06,730 --> 00:52:04,220
don't really know what's going on mm-hmm

1289
00:52:07,750 --> 00:52:06,740
and related to these things we're

1290
00:52:10,180 --> 00:52:07,760
talking about I don't know if you've

1291
00:52:12,640 --> 00:52:10,190
heard this story going around of the

1292
00:52:14,890 --> 00:52:12,650
missing guy from Brazil but it's pretty

1293
00:52:17,290 --> 00:52:14,900
interesting it involved some type of

1294
00:52:19,180 --> 00:52:17,300
high level code apparently this guy

1295
00:52:19,630 --> 00:52:19,190
after keeping his room locked for a

1296
00:52:22,570 --> 00:52:19,640
month

1297
00:52:25,240 --> 00:52:22,580
Bruno Borges had disappeared and left it

1298
00:52:27,490 --> 00:52:25,250
in it a fully encrypted language and

1299
00:52:29,079 --> 00:52:27,500
symbols all over the walls along with 14

1300
00:52:32,339 --> 00:52:29,089
handwritten books that were also

1301
00:52:36,250 --> 00:52:32,349
encrypted and a statue of Giordano Bruno

1302
00:52:38,130 --> 00:52:36,260
Italian philosopher worth about 2,500

1303
00:52:41,079 --> 00:52:38,140
dollars the books apparently were

1304
00:52:42,880 --> 00:52:41,089
impeccable in symmetry and alignment and

1305
00:52:44,950 --> 00:52:42,890
his family knew nothing about the statue

1306
00:52:47,130 --> 00:52:44,960
he was alone when it was delivered it

1307
00:52:50,140 --> 00:52:47,140
stands on a symbol that apparently

1308
00:52:50,770 --> 00:52:50,150
resembles an alchemists transmutation

1309
00:52:54,190 --> 00:52:50,780
circle

1310
00:52:56,050 --> 00:52:54,200
he was constantly asking people to

1311
00:52:58,180 --> 00:52:56,060
invest in a project that he had without

1312
00:53:00,460 --> 00:52:58,190
telling them what it was all about he

1313
00:53:02,079 --> 00:53:00,470
just told his mother he was writing 14

1314
00:53:05,320 --> 00:53:02,089
books that would change humanity in a

1315
00:53:07,540 --> 00:53:05,330
good way and he got a $6,500 loan from

1316
00:53:10,000 --> 00:53:07,550
his cousin and he said he was able to

1317
00:53:13,680 --> 00:53:10,010
finish his project but he disappeared on

1318
00:53:16,540 --> 00:53:13,690
March 27th and he left these 14

1319
00:53:19,800 --> 00:53:16,550
encrypted books arranged in a strange

1320
00:53:22,890 --> 00:53:19,810
way around this center circle very odd

1321
00:53:25,120 --> 00:53:22,900
we actually actually I did see that and

1322
00:53:28,270 --> 00:53:25,130
look at a couple of stories like that

1323
00:53:31,440 --> 00:53:28,280
almost identical one that springs to

1324
00:53:34,540 --> 00:53:31,450
mind was a guy named Wilbur Wilkinson in

1325
00:53:36,670 --> 00:53:34,550
1953 Wilbur Wilkinson a friend of his

1326
00:53:38,650 --> 00:53:36,680
named Carl hundra they rented an

1327
00:53:41,170 --> 00:53:38,660
aircraft from a small airstrip in

1328
00:53:43,030 --> 00:53:41,180
Southern California took to the skies

1329
00:53:45,430 --> 00:53:43,040
because they were supposedly going to

1330
00:53:47,680 --> 00:53:45,440
meet some very human looking aliens in

1331
00:53:50,079 --> 00:53:47,690
the California desert and this was very

1332
00:53:51,910 --> 00:53:50,089
much like the whole contactee movements

1333
00:53:54,310 --> 00:53:51,920
of the 50s you know going out to desert

1334
00:53:56,220 --> 00:53:54,320
locations and meeting these long-haired

1335
00:53:58,540 --> 00:53:56,230
space brothers that they were known and

1336
00:53:59,050 --> 00:53:58,550
reportedly Han Rath and will considered

1337
00:54:01,810 --> 00:53:59,060
being

1338
00:54:02,460 --> 00:54:01,820
contacting these aliens kind of like the

1339
00:54:04,380 --> 00:54:02,470
Collins

1340
00:54:06,839 --> 00:54:04,390
leading server minds of mine fashion

1341
00:54:07,890 --> 00:54:06,849
supposedly they channeled down that you

1342
00:54:10,200 --> 00:54:07,900
know we want to meet you in the desert

1343
00:54:12,000 --> 00:54:10,210
well they hired this aircraft took to

1344
00:54:14,640 --> 00:54:12,010
the skies and we're never seen again

1345
00:54:17,190 --> 00:54:14,650
the plane was never found home wrath and

1346
00:54:19,380 --> 00:54:17,200
Wilkinson were never found and the

1347
00:54:21,150 --> 00:54:19,390
police and the FBI there was a lot of

1348
00:54:23,280 --> 00:54:21,160
quite extensive investigation and

1349
00:54:25,020 --> 00:54:23,290
nothing ever turned up at all it was for

1350
00:54:26,670 --> 00:54:25,030
all intents and purposes they vanished

1351
00:54:29,460 --> 00:54:26,680
the playing of vanished

1352
00:54:31,140 --> 00:54:29,470
there was no telltale fires in the

1353
00:54:33,900 --> 00:54:31,150
surrounding hills you know in the trees

1354
00:54:36,900 --> 00:54:33,910
or whatever and they were just gone now

1355
00:54:41,160 --> 00:54:36,910
what happened was the police and the

1356
00:54:44,040 --> 00:54:41,170
press descended on Wilkinson's house and

1357
00:54:46,470 --> 00:54:44,050
in the basement even his wife can

1358
00:54:49,740 --> 00:54:46,480
realize this but all across the walls

1359
00:54:51,720 --> 00:54:49,750
will consume it sort of scrolled what he

1360
00:54:54,810 --> 00:54:51,730
believed was like some sort of ancient

1361
00:54:56,790 --> 00:54:54,820
alien language and it was described in

1362
00:54:59,490 --> 00:54:56,800
the local newspapers the LA press at the

1363
00:55:03,330 --> 00:54:59,500
time you know we vited down or made

1364
00:55:04,940 --> 00:55:03,340
their way in and you know they saw all

1365
00:55:08,579 --> 00:55:04,950
these sort of images these strange

1366
00:55:11,210 --> 00:55:08,589
hieroglyphics etc and it was perceived

1367
00:55:13,140 --> 00:55:11,220
as being the surveilling language that

1368
00:55:15,750 --> 00:55:13,150
Wilkinson will the Wilkins that have

1369
00:55:17,640 --> 00:55:15,760
been scrupulously writing it all across

1370
00:55:19,650 --> 00:55:17,650
the walls in his basement and he's dead

1371
00:55:21,900 --> 00:55:19,660
and he was never seen again and

1372
00:55:24,870 --> 00:55:21,910
apparently photographs were taken of

1373
00:55:26,310 --> 00:55:24,880
this odd writing and actually drawings

1374
00:55:28,560 --> 00:55:26,320
of them were reproduced in the local

1375
00:55:30,240 --> 00:55:28,570
newspapers but I actually haven't seen

1376
00:55:33,510 --> 00:55:30,250
the photograph so apparently somewhere

1377
00:55:35,370 --> 00:55:33,520
take and so his story in some respects

1378
00:55:38,760 --> 00:55:35,380
is actually quite close to this breaking

1379
00:55:40,800 --> 00:55:38,770
one as well amen well neck that about

1380
00:55:42,990 --> 00:55:40,810
does it for us another great book

1381
00:55:44,940 --> 00:55:43,000
written another great podcast recorded

1382
00:55:46,650 --> 00:55:44,950
again I really appreciate it man let the

1383
00:55:48,210 --> 00:55:46,660
people know what you got going on and

1384
00:55:50,970 --> 00:55:48,220
where they can get more Redfern in their

1385
00:55:54,480 --> 00:55:50,980
diet alrighty well I'll be speaking at a

1386
00:55:57,630 --> 00:55:54,490
conference in Kent Ohio called the Kent

1387
00:56:00,780 --> 00:55:57,640
Ohio paranormal weekend on the on the

1388
00:56:02,609 --> 00:56:00,790
last weekend of April and I'll be

1389
00:56:05,339 --> 00:56:02,619
speaking about all my research into the

1390
00:56:07,560 --> 00:56:05,349
men in black at that one and people can

1391
00:56:09,359 --> 00:56:07,570
reach me at my blog which is titled Nick

1392
00:56:11,190 --> 00:56:09,369
Redferns world of whatever so we just

1393
00:56:12,839 --> 00:56:11,200
type that into a search engine that

1394
00:56:15,820 --> 00:56:12,849
you'll find it'll come up as the first

1395
00:56:19,240 --> 00:56:15,830
entry people can reach me at Twitter

1396
00:56:20,830 --> 00:56:19,250
UFO or also at Facebook there's a bunch

1397
00:56:23,560 --> 00:56:20,840
of Nick Redferns if you scroll down

1398
00:56:25,480 --> 00:56:23,570
you'll see me and always happy to chat

1399
00:56:28,150 --> 00:56:25,490
with people got any questions wanna

1400
00:56:30,910 --> 00:56:28,160
share stories or want advice on anything

1401
00:56:34,900 --> 00:56:30,920
just let me know and if I can answer it

1402
00:56:36,780 --> 00:56:34,910
I will awesome well you are the man Nick

1403
00:56:39,870 --> 00:56:36,790
until next time keep doing what you do

1404
00:56:42,910 --> 00:56:39,880
alright thanks a lot Rick you got it and

1405
00:56:46,030 --> 00:56:42,920
boom goes that dynamite people Nick

1406
00:56:48,490 --> 00:56:46,040
Redfern doing what he does best bring in

1407
00:56:50,290 --> 00:56:48,500
the weird he is such a beast when it

1408
00:56:53,050 --> 00:56:50,300
comes to cranking out books I always

1409
00:56:54,550 --> 00:56:53,060
enjoy them and like I mentioned Nick is

1410
00:56:56,530 --> 00:56:54,560
been doing shows with me since the

1411
00:56:59,260 --> 00:56:56,540
beginning so I really got to thank him

1412
00:57:01,840 --> 00:56:59,270
it's been quite a ride if you are in the

1413
00:57:04,780 --> 00:57:01,850
Midwest it's not often there's a badass

1414
00:57:06,820 --> 00:57:04,790
event to go to believe me I know so if

1415
00:57:09,820 --> 00:57:06,830
you are free this weekend go see Nick at

1416
00:57:11,860 --> 00:57:09,830
the Kent Ohio paranormal weekend tell

1417
00:57:13,870 --> 00:57:11,870
him I said what's up but I thought this

1418
00:57:16,030 --> 00:57:13,880
was a good one I'm glad we got to talk

1419
00:57:19,560 --> 00:57:16,040
about the Collins elite saga something

1420
00:57:22,510 --> 00:57:19,570
I'm looking at with new eyes cicada 3301

1421
00:57:24,220 --> 00:57:22,520
glad that got back in the mix of course

1422
00:57:26,020 --> 00:57:24,230
I got to give a shout out as well to my

1423
00:57:28,570 --> 00:57:26,030
main man Kyle who actually brought up

1424
00:57:30,970 --> 00:57:28,580
that cicada recruitment theory on the

1425
00:57:33,220 --> 00:57:30,980
last QA that I did four plus members

1426
00:57:35,380 --> 00:57:33,230
that is why I kind of laughed when Nick

1427
00:57:37,840 --> 00:57:35,390
said he hadn't heard of it because I was

1428
00:57:39,850 --> 00:57:37,850
not surprised it's just something a

1429
00:57:42,130 --> 00:57:39,860
buddy of mine came up with but I thought

1430
00:57:44,020 --> 00:57:42,140
it was really interesting and that story

1431
00:57:47,170 --> 00:57:44,030
about the guy in Brazil is super weird

1432
00:57:49,630 --> 00:57:47,180
to write what the hell like the guy

1433
00:57:52,450 --> 00:57:49,640
opened a dimensional doorway and never

1434
00:57:54,580 --> 00:57:52,460
made it back I'm also really getting

1435
00:57:57,190 --> 00:57:54,590
into this explanation of magic for

1436
00:57:59,620 --> 00:57:57,200
everything I do realize this aliens are

1437
00:58:02,020 --> 00:57:59,630
magic the Montauk Project was magic

1438
00:58:02,830 --> 00:58:02,030
Roswell was magic the Loch Ness monster

1439
00:58:05,320 --> 00:58:02,840
was magic

1440
00:58:07,330 --> 00:58:05,330
I would understand if that's getting

1441
00:58:09,190 --> 00:58:07,340
annoying to some of you but that's kind

1442
00:58:10,750 --> 00:58:09,200
of where I leaned these days and we've

1443
00:58:13,350 --> 00:58:10,760
talked about the Loch Ness monster and

1444
00:58:15,880 --> 00:58:13,360
Bigfoot being some kind of paranormal

1445
00:58:17,500 --> 00:58:15,890
interdimensional stain so it's not

1446
00:58:20,020 --> 00:58:17,510
really that different but I guess I

1447
00:58:22,630 --> 00:58:20,030
suppose we're just considering the roles

1448
00:58:24,340 --> 00:58:22,640
of human consciousness or ritual

1449
00:58:26,920 --> 00:58:24,350
involvement in these things now I

1450
00:58:29,170 --> 00:58:26,930
definitely don't want to obsess over a

1451
00:58:31,150 --> 00:58:29,180
single narrative but this is the one

1452
00:58:33,609 --> 00:58:31,160
I find offered up the least in

1453
00:58:35,049 --> 00:58:33,619
conspiracy media and I think it also has

1454
00:58:37,750 --> 00:58:35,059
the most merit if you're really going to

1455
00:58:40,000 --> 00:58:37,760
get into stories like the nine or the

1456
00:58:41,349 --> 00:58:40,010
channelings with John Dee and these

1457
00:58:44,109 --> 00:58:41,359
things that people have seen during

1458
00:58:47,170 --> 00:58:44,119
intense ritual well the doors are wide

1459
00:58:49,089 --> 00:58:47,180
open to what's possible we are a show of

1460
00:58:51,609 --> 00:58:49,099
multiple perspectives and I do leave

1461
00:58:53,770 --> 00:58:51,619
space aliens on the table and an age

1462
00:58:55,710 --> 00:58:53,780
where I got to say a lot of people

1463
00:58:58,359 --> 00:58:55,720
aren't even leaving space on the table

1464
00:59:01,059 --> 00:58:58,369
yes I think NASA tells a lot of lies and

1465
00:59:04,870 --> 00:59:01,069
uses a lot of CGI but I don't know if

1466
00:59:08,349 --> 00:59:04,880
that means space itself it's fake

1467
00:59:10,930 --> 00:59:08,359
I just cannot go full Eric Dubay I am

1468
00:59:12,760 --> 00:59:10,940
sorry but you never go full Dubey I mean

1469
00:59:15,370 --> 00:59:12,770
isn't that what Robert Downey jr. said

1470
00:59:17,799 --> 00:59:15,380
in Tropic Thunder something like that I

1471
00:59:19,660 --> 00:59:17,809
still like the earthly beams living

1472
00:59:21,760 --> 00:59:19,670
inside the Earth from a previous age

1473
00:59:24,400 --> 00:59:21,770
explanation to let's not write that off

1474
00:59:26,410 --> 00:59:24,410
either of course it's funny because I

1475
00:59:28,450 --> 00:59:26,420
forget sometimes how deep I am in the

1476
00:59:30,609 --> 00:59:28,460
stuff and I might be drunk and wander

1477
00:59:32,260 --> 00:59:30,619
into my special ladies girl night and

1478
00:59:34,569 --> 00:59:32,270
start asking our friends if they think

1479
00:59:36,910 --> 00:59:34,579
aliens are really from space or more

1480
00:59:39,760 --> 00:59:36,920
inside the earth or any more spirits and

1481
00:59:44,230 --> 00:59:39,770
they just look at me like I have never

1482
00:59:47,319 --> 00:59:44,240
thought about that once ever so I just

1483
00:59:50,530 --> 00:59:47,329
go [\h__\h] off and ascend the stairs to my

1484
00:59:52,780 --> 00:59:50,540
isolation tower and it's just true so

1485
00:59:55,089 --> 00:59:52,790
many people don't believe that UFO

1486
00:59:57,940 --> 00:59:55,099
sightings or abductions or ritual

1487
01:00:00,520 --> 00:59:57,950
conjuring czar ever real that it never

1488
01:00:03,400 --> 01:00:00,530
happens I actually forget that some done

1489
01:00:04,750 --> 01:00:03,410
I look at different explanations for a

1490
01:00:06,910 --> 01:00:04,760
phenomenon that I've already fully

1491
01:00:08,500 --> 01:00:06,920
accepted and some people just think all

1492
01:00:11,380 --> 01:00:08,510
those stories and sightings and

1493
01:00:13,150 --> 01:00:11,390
documents just amount to nothing which

1494
01:00:15,700 --> 01:00:13,160
to me is actually harder to believe at

1495
01:00:17,530 --> 01:00:15,710
this point what I do find silly though

1496
01:00:18,520 --> 01:00:17,540
is the disclosure narrative that the

1497
01:00:20,799 --> 01:00:18,530
government is going to tell us

1498
01:00:23,380 --> 01:00:20,809
everything eventually or if we just ask

1499
01:00:25,630 --> 01:00:23,390
right it's like we're Oliver Twist style

1500
01:00:27,690 --> 01:00:25,640
orphans shuffling up to Congress please

1501
01:00:30,370 --> 01:00:27,700
serve can I have a little disclosure

1502
01:00:32,500 --> 01:00:30,380
begging Congress who probably doesn't

1503
01:00:35,230 --> 01:00:32,510
know [\h__\h] anyway about disclosure is

1504
01:00:37,359 --> 01:00:35,240
futile if you ask me I think a lot of

1505
01:00:40,770 --> 01:00:37,369
its deep state and deep corporate now

1506
01:00:42,390 --> 01:00:40,780
and they're not telling anybody anything

1507
01:00:43,860 --> 01:00:42,400
never look to Authority for answers

1508
01:00:47,010 --> 01:00:43,870
never look to them for help

1509
01:00:49,170 --> 01:00:47,020
so I'm rambling at this point but if you

1510
01:00:51,570 --> 01:00:49,180
like the first hour of this show please

1511
01:00:53,670 --> 01:00:51,580
sign up and become a member of THC plus

1512
01:00:56,010 --> 01:00:53,680
you get an extra hour of this in every

1513
01:00:58,560 --> 01:00:56,020
episode lifetime access to the forum's

1514
01:01:00,840 --> 01:00:58,570
the occasional extra stuff like the QA I

1515
01:01:02,280 --> 01:01:00,850
mentioned earlier five bucks a month

1516
01:01:04,950 --> 01:01:02,290
five shows a month

1517
01:01:06,960 --> 01:01:04,960
nice and simple in today's plus show if

1518
01:01:09,930 --> 01:01:06,970
you're wondering what you missed or what

1519
01:01:11,610 --> 01:01:09,940
you got extra we got into alchemy and

1520
01:01:13,530 --> 01:01:11,620
the men in black of the old world

1521
01:01:15,900 --> 01:01:13,540
apparently they had visitations of a

1522
01:01:18,300 --> 01:01:15,910
similar nature we talked about shamanic

1523
01:01:20,790 --> 01:01:18,310
shape-shifting cultures and those

1524
01:01:23,040 --> 01:01:20,800
traditions around the globe those way

1525
01:01:24,720 --> 01:01:23,050
more out there than I thought we also

1526
01:01:25,770 --> 01:01:24,730
got into the story of the hexam heads

1527
01:01:27,960 --> 01:01:25,780
which was new to me

1528
01:01:30,390 --> 01:01:27,970
cannibalism and groups that practice it

1529
01:01:33,570 --> 01:01:30,400
groups and sects that have formed around

1530
01:01:36,360 --> 01:01:33,580
UFO sightings like Heaven's Gate the

1531
01:01:39,720 --> 01:01:36,370
curious connections between fascism and

1532
01:01:42,360 --> 01:01:39,730
the occult / UFOs I mean you don't have

1533
01:01:44,280 --> 01:01:42,370
to dig too deep to see some threads

1534
01:01:46,860 --> 01:01:44,290
there that connect and maybe you're

1535
01:01:48,750 --> 01:01:46,870
asking yourself why like I was we got

1536
01:01:51,150 --> 01:01:48,760
into the case that the cattle mutilation

1537
01:01:53,010 --> 01:01:51,160
saga could be more related to ritual

1538
01:01:56,010 --> 01:01:53,020
than ray-guns again with this [\h__\h] for

1539
01:01:58,470 --> 01:01:56,020
me right and we got next thoughts on the

1540
01:02:01,740 --> 01:01:58,480
state of the secret space program all

1541
01:02:03,840 --> 01:02:01,750
classic higher side chat stuff go to the

1542
01:02:05,280 --> 01:02:03,850
higher side chats plus calm - sign up

1543
01:02:08,190 --> 01:02:05,290
for the full ride if you haven't already

1544
01:02:10,230 --> 01:02:08,200
thanks to those who do this is a good

1545
01:02:12,180 --> 01:02:10,240
one I think I've done what I can

1546
01:02:14,130 --> 01:02:12,190
your move underground organizations

1547
01:02:18,510 --> 01:02:14,140
secret societies fraternal orders and

1548
01:02:21,700 --> 01:02:18,520
ritual workers you're [\h__\h]

1549
01:02:24,490 --> 01:02:21,710
lucid dreams are so vivid cuz you go to

1550
01:02:27,520 --> 01:02:24,500
bed at 7:00 and your brain comes alive

1551
01:02:30,160 --> 01:02:27,530
because uhm nine to five you wake up

1552
01:02:32,650 --> 01:02:30,170
with a dread and make sure your cats are

1553
01:02:34,990 --> 01:02:32,660
fed did your brain talk to ghosts who

1554
01:02:39,040 --> 01:02:35,000
moved your coffee and eat toast as you

1555
01:02:41,680 --> 01:02:39,050
listen to the higher side chat you get

1556
01:02:44,349 --> 01:02:41,690
to your desk and your boss says it's a

1557
01:02:46,780 --> 01:02:44,359
mess and your soul slowly goes to a

1558
01:02:49,150 --> 01:02:46,790
place where nothing grows when you think

1559
01:02:53,620 --> 01:02:49,160
he's not around you insert a steady

1560
01:02:56,320 --> 01:02:53,630
sound the Oh whimpers turn it down and

1561
01:03:00,750 --> 01:02:56,330
you say it's just the higher side chat

1562
01:03:05,460 --> 01:03:00,760
oh do you think you be invited to

1563
01:03:09,250 --> 01:03:05,470
Bohemian Grove to a Bilderberg Club oh

1564
01:03:15,070 --> 01:03:09,260
do you think you're being invited by

1565
01:03:19,120 --> 01:03:15,080
Rasta to a party on a submarine diving

1566
01:03:21,760 --> 01:03:19,130
down to the center of the earth to the

1567
01:03:25,810 --> 01:03:21,770
Marianas Trench your teeth begin to

1568
01:03:29,200 --> 01:03:25,820
clench from the sulphureus stench the

1569
01:03:35,109 --> 01:03:29,210
mask you give in doesn't it

1570
01:03:37,420 --> 01:03:35,119
because you're not one of them starting

1571
01:03:40,150 --> 01:03:37,430
today you'll make plans to get away

1572
01:03:42,849 --> 01:03:40,160
there's no one to hold you down and the

1573
01:03:45,520 --> 01:03:42,859
what is start to drown then you wake to

1574
01:03:48,339 --> 01:03:45,530
the glare of Akko fluorescents there and

1575
01:03:50,650 --> 01:03:48,349
the light winks at you cuz its life is

1576
01:03:54,309 --> 01:03:50,660
almost through but it's holding gone too

1577
01:03:56,650 --> 01:03:54,319
quick time just like you it's time for